Cam Shaft help - Nissan Murano Forum
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#1 Old 02-23-2013, 02:10 PM
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Cam Shaft help

I have an 04 murano and it has been acting up. Well first I want to say that my oil pan is rusted and it is leaking oil through it. EVen when i have oil, my engine makes a clicking sound. So I decided to put oil in it from autozone yesterday, about a quart, and it went away. Now helre comes my issue. My SES light came on and pulled the code. I got P0011 and they said it was my Cam shaft position sensor. Does anyone have the step by step directions in how to replace it? Is it hard? And if i change bank 1 do i need to change bank 2 also? That is what a mechanic told me but i think he just wants a bigger pay. A video tutorial would help if anyone has one. Besides me pulling the code, I think its my CAMSHAFT because my car is realllllly acting sluggish while accelerating like i have an 1985 minivan, probaly worse. Plus my car turns off time to time and i have to try about twoor three times to restart it. All in all, I wanna know if im replacing the right thing, and I want to know if the job is simple so I can do it myself

Thanks you to whoever reads this and tries to help me
George
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#2 Old 02-24-2013, 02:03 PM
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P0011 does not condemn the cam sensor. In most cases, this code is set by low oil level/low oil pressure, or sludged up oil passages for the VCT.

I'd asses the oil condition (change it), and go from there.

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#3 Old 02-24-2013, 05:05 PM
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I changed the oil but it's still there. My mechanic said it's my camshafts sensors for sure but I also have a rusted oil pan with a couple of wholes in it. I'm going to change it too
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#4 Old 02-24-2013, 05:07 PM
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Plus my car turns on and off
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#5 Old 02-24-2013, 06:03 PM
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Again. P0011 does not condemn the CMP sensor. All it says is that VCT angle observed doesn't match desired.

If you've already changed the oil, try some seafoam to blow the sludge out of the VCT system and check oil pressure. If all that is kosher, the next step is to swap the VCT solenoids between the heads and see if you start getting a P0021. If the problem moves with the actuator, replace it. If it doesnt, the VCT sprocket is jammed up and needs replaced.

This code is very common on older VQs that have been neglected. Running low on oil is not good on the VCT system.
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#6 Old 02-24-2013, 06:59 PM
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Sorry im kind of new to these kind of things and dont follow you with such terms. What do you mean try some seafoam to blow the sludge out of the VCT system .
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#7 Old 02-24-2013, 07:14 PM
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VCT= Variable Cam Timing. The engine uses oil pressure fed to a fancy sprocket and controlled by a valve to vary the advance of the Intake cam. This gives better power, emissions and MPG. The ECM reads the cam sensors to see if the advance it wants is happening. If it isnt, The ECM sets p0011 or P0021. A bad cam sensor is unlikely to cause these codes. A bad cam sensor will set a Code of the P034x flavor.

Seafoam is an engine cleaner. You add it to the oil, drive the car for a day or so, then change the oil and filter. Instructions are on the bottle. it should break up the sludge that is likely present from having been run low on oil for who knows how long, or missing oil changes sometime in the last decade. The oil passages for the VCT arent very big, and they do have screens. So they clog easily. IF they clog, no oil will get where it is needed and VCT wont work.

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#8 Old 02-25-2013, 12:25 AM
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First, I wanna thank you for the effort and time i recieved from you. Second, I want to just verify that what i have to do is buy seafoam, and put it in with my oil ( not gasoline) and then get the oil change the very next day to get rid off the sludgy material that has build up over the years. ( Note.. I get oil changes every 3 k miles for the past year, which is when i purchased the vehicle.) Do yu think I should change my oil pan also because it is rusted and it is leaking a very small puddle every day.
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#9 Old 02-25-2013, 11:48 AM
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Right. In the oil. Just follow the instructions on the bottle.

if the pan is rusted to the point of leaking, yes it needs replaced.
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#10 Old 02-25-2013, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KtG View Post
VCT= Variable Cam Timing. The engine uses oil pressure fed to a fancy sprocket and controlled by a valve to vary the advance of the Intake cam. This gives better power, emissions and MPG. The ECM reads the cam sensors to see if the advance it wants is happening. If it isnt, The ECM sets p0011 or P0021. A bad cam sensor is unlikely to cause these codes. A bad cam sensor will set a Code of the P034x flavor.

Seafoam is an engine cleaner. You add it to the oil, drive the car for a day or so, then change the oil and filter. Instructions are on the bottle. it should break up the sludge that is likely present from having been run low on oil for who knows how long, or missing oil changes sometime in the last decade. The oil passages for the VCT arent very big, and they do have screens. So they clog easily. IF they clog, no oil will get where it is needed and VCT wont work.
Sorry, I want to disagree and suggest a different course of action.

Nothing the OP has posted indicates the presence of sludge. I don't know where that assumption comes from in the post above, but it is unlikely to be the case.

Seafoam has more than one use, and its typical use is in combustion chambers to reduce carbon or other deposits on valves and pistons. For that application, it's normally fed into the intake plenum and burned while the engine is running.

Personally, I would not add anything to the motor oil that thins it and then drive the car, since driving exerts load on the engine. Seafoam is a thin material which can compromise the oil film and oil chemistry and might result in damage to the engine. When you add anything to oil that will thin it, driving the vehicle and putting the engine under load is a very bad idea. Typically, when you add cleaning/thinning agents to oil, the instructions specifically tell you just to run the engine in the driveway...not drive it.

If you have been running synthetic oil, then formation of "sludge" in the oil is EXTREMELY UNLIKELY. Synthetic oil is highly resistant to building deposits or "sludge" in the engine. In that case, using Seafoam in the oil is meaningless and a waste of money, as well as having potential to cause engine damage due to compromised oil film. I just don't see this as a desirable course of action.

If I did determine that I had a sludge problem (something that I have seen only once in 40+ years of driving, but maybe that's because I change the oil...) I would remedy it by using an internal engine oil cleaner - NOT driving the car, but using it according to label instructions by idling the car in the driveway - and then doing multiple oil changes in quick succession. Using synthetic oil, that process will absolutely clean the oil circulation areas. In the case where I did experience this, I used Gunk brand engine cleaner (comes in a 1 quart can) according to labeled directions. I have also used Gunk just for insurance when I was changing engines from petro oils to synthetic, which I have done with engines which have had up to 100K miles on them at the event.

But there is no evidence that this problem even exists. I strongly recommend that the OP not add Seafoam to his oil and then drive the car for any period.

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#11 Old 02-25-2013, 04:23 PM
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heres my pan..Cam Shaft help-image.jpg
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#12 Old 02-25-2013, 10:50 PM
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No argument on the pan. Others have reported oil pans that have rusted through.

Which absolutely AMAZES me. Never heard of such a thing. Nissan must have had their local fast food restaurant stamp those oil pans out of tinfoil.

Fortunately, reports indicate that it's quite easy to remove and replace. Just search for threads on this topic.

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#13 Old 02-26-2013, 11:42 AM
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I know you cant really tell by the picture, but do u think that my oil pan is the reason why the P0011 code comes up, and why my murano acts really sludgy when i try to accelerate?
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#14 Old 02-26-2013, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by gtpityou View Post
I know you cant really tell by the picture, but do u think that my oil pan is the reason why the P0011 code comes up, and why my murano acts really sludgy when i try to accelerate?
Absolutely not. No way is that possible. All the oil pan does is keep the oil from falling out the bottom of the motor. It is a passive part that has no influence on the performance of the motor as long as it's in place.

And I would encourage you to try different terms which may be more helpful in understanding your problem. A motor cannot act "sludgy" (that term has no meaning in terms of performance) and I suspect that use of that word has led to a misinterpretation of your symptoms.

The motor may:
- lack power and accelerate too slowly
- hesitate while accelerating
- rev up without a corresponding increase in speed

Similar descriptive language in observable, physical terms would be helpful and might result in more accurate responses.

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#15 Old 02-26-2013, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Pilgrim View Post
Sorry, I want to disagree and suggest a different course of action.

Nothing the OP has posted indicates the presence of sludge. I don't know where that assumption comes from in the post above, but it is unlikely to be the case.

Seafoam has more than one use, and its typical use is in combustion chambers to reduce carbon or other deposits on valves and pistons. For that application, it's normally fed into the intake plenum and burned while the engine is running.

Personally, I would not add anything to the motor oil that thins it and then drive the car, since driving exerts load on the engine. Seafoam is a thin material which can compromise the oil film and oil chemistry and might result in damage to the engine. When you add anything to oil that will thin it, driving the vehicle and putting the engine under load is a very bad idea. Typically, when you add cleaning/thinning agents to oil, the instructions specifically tell you just to run the engine in the driveway...not drive it.

If you have been running synthetic oil, then formation of "sludge" in the oil is EXTREMELY UNLIKELY. Synthetic oil is highly resistant to building deposits or "sludge" in the engine. In that case, using Seafoam in the oil is meaningless and a waste of money, as well as having potential to cause engine damage due to compromised oil film. I just don't see this as a desirable course of action.

If I did determine that I had a sludge problem (something that I have seen only once in 40+ years of driving, but maybe that's because I change the oil...) I would remedy it by using an internal engine oil cleaner - NOT driving the car, but using it according to label instructions by idling the car in the driveway - and then doing multiple oil changes in quick succession. Using synthetic oil, that process will absolutely clean the oil circulation areas. In the case where I did experience this, I used Gunk brand engine cleaner (comes in a 1 quart can) according to labeled directions. I have also used Gunk just for insurance when I was changing engines from petro oils to synthetic, which I have done with engines which have had up to 100K miles on them at the event.

But there is no evidence that this problem even exists. I strongly recommend that the OP not add Seafoam to his oil and then drive the car for any period.
P0011 and P0021 are fairly common codes on VQs of this vintage. I've played this game before. Many times in fact. First step is checking oil level. Then you change it. Because old oil just doesn't seem to work right when it gets thin. Only in the rarest of cases do those steps fail to resolve the problem. Then one goes to a cleaner to get the build up out of the very tiny passages. I've never had to replace a VCT sprocket for this, and only once replaced the VCT oil control valve.

This is B1 we are dealing with, and the OP doesn't seem to be the technical type. So I'm trying to keep it simple. Plus, he really hasn't reached the stage where it is time to remove the VCT oil control, though I have mentioned it. again, B1, and nothing about B1 is fun. It makes sense to test from least to most invasive, and that is what we are doing here.

VQ's build varnish and sludge like it is their job. They are not forgiving of missed oil changes or unchanged PCV valves at all. The vehicle has spent most of its life out of the OP's hands, for all we know its first owner leased and abused it.

Seafoam, Gunk, same thing. Get some sort of engine cleaner in there, hell, change to a different oil with a different detergent package. But we need to try and clean out the oil passages. Because they are likely the problem at this point. Options to test that in other ways arent pretty, and this does work.

I know I'm just a dude on the internet. I suppose I could post a picture of my ugly mug next to my Nissan training Certification plaques, but that really seems silly. P0011 is a VCT malfunction. Not a sensor issue. Oil control is the root cause. Too thin, not enough, obstruction in the passage. A VQ that should have VCT and doesn't is a total pooch. There may be another drivability issue killing power, but we KNOW we have a VCT issue. So start there. The vehicle has to be driven, because VCT wont actuate much at all while parked.

Yes, replace the pan. It didn't 'cause' the problem, but it wont help it. VCT needs a proper oil level to work, and the pan is leaking oil.

SCOPE Senior Specialist, DFRT and EV. ASE Master Technician.
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