| pbeinetti |
| Does anyone know how to remove the lumbar support in the driver's seat? I have had alot of back pain driving my M-o, and have tried almost everything. I seem to be better in the passenger seat which does not have the solid rod for the lumbar, but a spring. I'd like to remove the lumbar and experiment by using a spring instead. I'd take it to my Nissan dealer to take out the lumbar but I know he would charge me a fortune. |
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| rokyracoon |
I also am having back trouble in the drivers seat as opposed to the passenger seat. I'm looking to find some kind of seat cushion to try to relieve the uncomfortableness. Is that a word???
Let me know what you come up with. |
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| CVeeT |
| Wonder if it is possible to reverse the seats for you. Of course the seat controls will be hard to reach in the gap. |
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| pmw0826 |
| Thought I was the only one with this problem, so I did not post on it before. I test drove briefly an '03 with cloth. . no problem; then borrowed a friend's '03 with leather for a day or two . . again no problem. My '04 has leather and this has too much lumbar. I wonder if it is the power lumbar? I think it is the fact that the lumbar is too low. I have a Saab 9-5 wagon (soon to go), a Saab 9-3SE convertible, and a Chrysler T&C, and the lumbar on all of them seems to be a little higher. I agree, however, just to be able to turn it off more would be great. How can we do it? |
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| esemes |
2004 is power lumbar.....................
it should be possible to have a custom upholstery shop pull the seat and maybe either supplement the lumbar cushion, or, remove it altogether......
i feel the seats are too flat (making the lumb. feel as if it pushed out too much), and would be better served to have side bolster augmentation....
esemes
(l-5 lumbarectomy) |
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| Riv |
| I't's good (bad) to hear others with the same problem as me. My back kills me after a drive in my MO, and I can't seem to find a sweet spot with the seat adjustments. I thought it was because I'm 6'4". Are any or all of you tall? I think we should send something to nissan about this. The lumbar support is way too low. What's up with that? |
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| pbeinetti |
Enforcer:
Does the manual give any hint on how to remove the lumbar? I've got the back of the seat apart (wasn't easy), but I can't figure out where to start with the lumbar removal. |
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| esemes |
try actuating it to see how the paddle moves outward (from the arm)
then you might find the answer that way (hope) |
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| Enforcer |
| Snap ring on lever?: |
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| pmw0826 |
| Like I said in my last post, I can't quite figure out why the '03 seemed comfortable to be, but the '04 sure isn't. Sounds like the '03's have similar problems. Yesterday, I drove my '01 9-5 wagon and my wife's '02 Chrysler T&C, followed by the MO and to my way of thinking not only is the lumbar out too far when it is off, but also it seems like it is lower (more in the belt area rather than a true lumbar area). All I know is that as much as I love the MO, this is a literal pain in the back. I hope we can come up with a solution. I bought the MO for its comfort, now I don't have what I really wanted. |
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| pbeinetti |
| I have had continued back pain from the M-o from the first day I bought it. We took it on a coast to coast trip soon after getting it and there were many times I needed to stop and get out of the car my back was so sore. I have taken the backing off the seat and made numerous changes, but nothing seems to work. I've come to believe that the way the facing of the seat is designed is wrong for some people. My last resort is to take the lumbar off . I'll use a seat pad if I need to, but I'll sell the car before I use a seat pad full time. |
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| Enforcer |
I suggest you call 1-800-NISSAN1. They are going to ask if you talked to your dealer first, so you might talk to your dealer first.
I'm 6'1" and it's perfect for me. I have my lumbar set to max. |
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| pmw0826 |
| Each and every one of us has our own personal choice of seating position. That's why the MO should be so great. When one has an infinite number of seating positions, lumbar position, plus pedal position, one would think that a perfect level of comfort could be achieved. Although I have scratched the h%^^ out of the door panel, my seat position is perfect, actually two positions. However, I cant' get the lumbar anywhere near where it should be. This is a d*&^ shame in my opinion. I hope there are enough of us who have a problem that Nissan can come up with some sort of solution. The MO is too perfect ( in my case so far 800 miles) to have a problem like this permanently detract from its usefullness. I've said that if I cannot get this fixed, I'll take my loss and get another car quickly. . a darn shame I feel. . .but comfort is very important when one drives a great deal. |
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| rokyracoon |
| Today I brought my Chiropractor out to my car to see if he could adjust the seat to fit my posture. He mentioned that the seat cushion is too short and the cushion is not flat enough. The bump in the seat cushion causes a "valley" between the seat back and the seat cushion which causes the back problems. Just one more annoyance that will have to be fixed by an after market product or my pillow. |
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| pbeinetti |
Rokyracoon:
What did your chiro means by the "bump in the seat cushion causes a valley between the seat back and the seat cushion"? Does he mean you sit too low in the back of the seat cushion? I've wondered about that myself, if that's what he means. I would like to sit more flat on the cushion, but the front of the seat won't go low enough. I'm 6 feet tall and when I lift the back of the seat cushion high enough so my butt is flat I'm nearly touching the roof with my head. |
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| rokyracoon |
That's it exactly. If you sit in the passenger seat, you'll see that you won't have this problem. Oh well, at least the car looks good.
I'm looking for a seat cushion to see if this will solve the problem. Of course with a seat cushion, you can't use the heated seat. I'll let you know my progress. Let me know what you find out. |
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| rokyracoon |
| Thanks Enforcer for the info. This is why I bought a Herman Miller Aeron chair for my office. Now lets send this article to Nissan. |
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| Enforcer |
Well...I think they will say that is exactly how the MO drivers seat is designed. That document shows exactly what the MO lumbar does for me and I have been on five - 10 hour road trips with no problems. And I have lower back disk problems. I wish my chair at work had lumbar support.
But it doesn't work for some people. The issue seems to be, it is either too much, not enough or it needs to have a vertical adjustment to accomodate a wider range of people.
Talk to your dealer and NNA. They may be able to remove the lumbar support or move it up or down to fit your needs. They may also be able to add supports or padding. Your chiro or doctor may be of some help in this process too, determine at exactly what height and how much throw you need.
If none of that pans out, and you can't do it yourself, I would try a local auto shop. |
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| pbeinetti |
| The issue with me (my son in the Mo, also) is my upper back. After about 30 minutes the upper back muscles start to get very sore. I took the back cover off the seat and found a very stiff spring goes right across the middle of the seat, and also the active head rest has a very stiff spring holding it upright. I took both springs off and found that the seat is better -- it's not so hard, and it gives better side support because you sit into it further. But, the pain isn't totally gone yet. To remove the lumbar (which is a 1/4 inch steel rod, with a plastic sort of paddle connected to it) looks to be a difficult job. There is a spring on the passenger seat, where the lumbar is on the driver's seat. The driver's seat has the connections for the spring, which is why I'd like to remove the lumbar and replace it with a spring -- just to see if it's better. When I have too much lumbar in a chair my back hurts, and since the steel rod is always there, and can't be moved any further back than the lumbar lever allows, it limits the different positions I can use. |
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| Enforcer |
| Can you post a pic or two of the seat structure around the lumbar? |
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| pbeinetti |
Enforcer:
Tell me how to post a pic -- never done it. |
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| Enforcer |
See this thread.
When you are typing in the post box like I am doing now, there is an Attach file box and Browse button at the bottom just above the Submit Reply button. Clicking browse will allow you to search your compter for the file you want to attach, in this case a jpeg or .jpg. Note the max file size limit. |
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| pbeinetti |
| Here is a picture of the back of the M-o driver's seat, seat back removed. |
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| esemes |
perhaps the paddle can be offset "higher" with some zip ties (or hoseclamps or U bolts) and new holes drilled thru it??
that way, it could be relocated, if needbeso |
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| Enforcer |
Good pic, but it's hard to tell without close ups of the left and right side attachment points. It could be you remove the snap ring and lever and slide the assembly to the left until the right side comes out and then slide it to the right to get the left side out. Don't want to punch a hole in the left side covering though, might have to remove the covering. Either that, or it's just one big spring and you push in from either side until one end disengages, I'd bet left first then right. Ahh.. left right looking at the back of the seat like your pic is.
But, the coil spring is the problem. That will have to be removed eventually and I would think it should be disengaged before removing the bar. But maybe not if the 1/4" bar is just one big spring itself in which case left first then right. The coil spring looks fairly healthy though, have to be careful when it lets go, could punch a hole in the covering. I would place a wood/metal plate temporarily back there just in case.
Can you get some close ups of the attachment points? |
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| pbeinetti |
| I'm working on it today. I found a way to jam the spring attachment so the lumbar doesn't push forward. I've actually moved it away from the foam by another half inch. Removing the assembly required that I take the seat apart. The assembly is screwed onto the frame from the outside, which would mean taking everything apart. I figured jamming it was the easier route to see if it makes any difference. I've come up with a spring to replace the lumbar -- seems to work well and allows me to sit into the seat, but still have good support. Interesting find-- the horizontal spring across the active head rest assembly cuts into the back of the foam when you sit back. It causes a pressure point. I have resolved that by drilling a hole in the frame and moving the place where the spring attaches further out from the foam. We'll see how it all works. I've got another couple of things to try. |
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| pbeinetti |
| OK, I'm done for today. This is what I did. I jammed the lumbar so it wouldn't put any pressure on the foam -- and, moved it back from the foam about another half inch. Then I installed a spring where the lumbar was. This allows me to sit further back in the seat, but still have the support from a spring -- rather than the lumbar which is too firm for me. Now it feels much more like the passenger seat. I also drilled holes on both sides of the frame and moved the horizontal active head rest spring back to eliminate the pressure points on both sides from the spring pressing against the foam when I sat back. I also put a piece of carpet under the seat cushion -- between the foam and the seat cushion springs -- to raise the butt somewhat -- so there is less of a "valley" as one of the posters mentioned his chiropractor had said. Finally I bent the seat frame on each side in about 1/8 to 1/4 inch. This did two things. First, it reduced the "pull" from the leather on each side of my back so I can sit into the seat more -- and, best of all, I now can feel the "wings of the seat (side lumbar) on each side of my back so it feels more like a sports car. Before, on a curve, I wouldn't be held by the seat (like my WRX). Now I am -- very different from the passenger seat which I haven't changed. It was a simple thing to do. I just took a heavy screwdriver, put it in an existing hole on each side of the frame, and bent the frame. I read someplace that the Japanese designed the Murano for the "typical" overweight American, so they oversized the seat cushions and seat backs. My 6', 170 lb frame slid all over the place -- no more! I'll report back on the changes after I have driven it awhile. |
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| Riv |
pbeinetti, How did you get off the seat back cover to expose the lumbar support?
:confused: |
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| Riv |
Viola!!! :2:
First of all thank you to pbeinetti for providing the pics and the idea! I was able to get the rear seat back cover off, (Vigorously queeze inward horizontally on the bottom first) then I remove that pesky spring that lies about half way up the back of the seat (see pbeinetti's pic on this thread). Boy was that a relief! The stress on my back and kidneys from that one spring was enormous! Removing the spring is extremly easy, just hold one side of the seat and with your hands, push the spring towards that side until it releases from where it's hooked. If ever I sell my MO I can easily put the spring back again. Easy stuff! It doesn't compromise the structure of the seat frame, it's there strictly as some sort of querky back support. What a relief!
I did not do the other things pbienetti did, removing the spring was all I needed.
Fellow MO owners with back trouble, you should try removing that pesky spring. I'm in love again!:29: |
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| Riv |
I forgot to mention, the spring I'm refering to is the wavy U shaped one.
Also, it does not effect in any way the use of your adjustable lumbar support, in fact, lumbar now feels a lot more comfortable. |
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| pmw0826 |
| Thank you all for the information. My dealer suggested that they refer all their interior work to an upholstery shop which I shall contact tomorrow. I love my MO and hope that this will make my back happy. If I need more info I shall ask. Thanks! |
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| pbeinetti |
| Riv: I'm glad you were able to get the seat back off OK. That can be difficult. I was going to post a pic tonight, but it looks like I don't need to. Yes, that wavy spring is a menace to anyone who has upper back pain. I drove yesterday about 200 miles and had little problem after making the changes I mentioned on an earlier post. I am going to bend the side lumbars a bit more when I get the chance, just to give a little more side support. Glad your back feels better. Anyone with back pain knows how awful it can be to drive a car that aggravates the pain. |
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| pmw0826 |
Does my problem apply? I feel that there is too much pressure on the lower back close to the belt and not enough pressure on the lumbar area? If this is what you have done, my problem is solved, please advise.
Thanks |
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| pbeinetti |
| I also felt there was too much pressure at the belt, which is why I disabled the lumbar. I think the lumbar is placed too low. You'll need to experiment because each of our backs is different. |
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| krpster |
quote:
Originally posted by Riv
I't's good (bad) to hear others with the same problem as me. My back kills me after a drive in my MO, and I can't seem to find a sweet spot with the seat adjustments. I thought it was because I'm 6'4". Are any or all of you tall? I think we should send something to nissan about this. The lumbar support is way too low. What's up with that?
I am 6'6" and I also have back trouble problems and find the seat uncomfortable after long drives. The only thing I can do to help is change the lumbar position every so often while I drive. This way my back isn't in the same position all the time. |
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| hhuangpe |
(Vigorously queeze inward horizontally on the bottom first) - can you be a little more descriptive on this? I am not sure "horizontally inward" is that toward frone or toward passenger side?
I assume the back is attched to the seat frame with plastic screws?
Thanks, |
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| Riv |
| Sorry it took a while to reply, What I mean is to face the back of the drivers seat. That "shell" on the back of the seat is what I'm referring to. Place your hands about midway down the shell, on the boths side edges ( sort of as if your're squezzing 2 melons!). Then push the edges towards one another. That motion will release the clamps that hold the shell to the back of the chair . You'll also have to manipulate the top and bottom of the shell release it , but squeezing the sides together is first step. Remember, it's a finesse thing, so make sure you don't go all out and snap it in half. It took about 1 inch or less to release mine. When released, pull the shell towards you slightly and down to release the clamp up top. Good luck. Have fun! |
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| Riv |
| I forgot to followup on this thread. I was able to get full and final satisfaction when I purchased a lumbar cushion from a store called Relax the back.com The cushion is made of that visco elastic memory foam, so it really conforms to the shape of "your" lumbar spine. It fills the void left between the your lumbar area and the back seat without intruding into your back like an ordinary foam cushion would. On the seat side it shapes itself to the contour of the seat. I really really like it. In fact, I finally have totally put the MO's driver seat problem "behind" me! I still recommend taking out the spring. For me, it lay right across my kidney region and was sheer torture.:2: |
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