| dalsox |
my MO came with standard halogen lights, but now i want to upgrade without buying cheap blue bulbs, and i have the opprotunity to buy new headlamp casings complete with hid bulbs.
im wondering if these will just convert with a few simple wire plugs, or will this be more complicated?
a little advice is helpful |
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| SugarRushMurano |
since i bought my car last november.
Buying the oem xenon headlamp will complicate the matters here. Why? BEcause the oem xenon headlight has all wiring harness ready to be pluggeg into a murano that is meant to have HID.
A murano that meant to have HID have pre-wired harness in the engine cabin:
- wiring for xenon ground
- wiring for xenon vdc (voltage source)
- wiring for auto leveler motor.
The easier way to retrofit HID to halogen Murano is to take out the halogen headlamp, custom fit hella bi-xenon projector into it, use manual leveler. One also needs to tap to the batery + terminal using a relay and find a good ground in the engine bay to ground the ballast of the HID.
FYI, me and a bunch of friend in college did retrofit to my other car that i recently sold.
Where are you located?
Maybe you can pm me, it is nice to have a buddy in this retrofit venture....I am in no hurry to do the retrofit,, but for now certainly i will do it in a month or two. Need to do more research. |
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| yoyash |
| I understand that some of the after market HID is low beam only... |
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| SugarRushMurano |
meaning: the hid bulbs are rebased D2S (to fit the halogen 9007 base). This is similar to fitting 2mm screw to 3mm.
This method will yield incorrect beam cut off, shorter bulb life and not to mention the possiblility of being caught doing illegal conversion.
The right retrofit (even though still illegal, but less prone to detection) is to use exatcly the bi-xenon projector inside the headlight and use d2s HID bulb. All hid bulbs are D2s, some are d2r. OEM nissan use d2s philips and hella ballast mounted under the headlamp.
By using the bixenon projector, it will be exatcly like OEM and one will not loose the hi beam....
Will post pic once my conversion project is done. |
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| Eric L. |
SugarRushMurano is correct. Avoid those cheap reflector based HID solutions (i.e. D2r HID reflector bulbs meant to fit into stock headlight housings). I had one on my 97 Maxima, and while light output was good, the beam pattern was terrible. I was so happy when I got legal and properly aimed HIDs on my Murano.
I agree that the best way to retrofit HID onto a Murano is to find a solution which replaces the projector in the headlight housing. Do halogen headlight Muranos have projectors or reflectors? |
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| SugarRushMurano |
The murano halogen headlamp is reflector type, non projector.
This cause another complication to the retrofit process...
Why? Because not only one need to try to retrofit the bixenon projector into it, but he or she needs to 'clean out' the halogen-type reflecting surface as well....
One way to do this is by convering this refelecting halogen light surface with smooth reflective film surface. But to do this, the entire headlamp must be taken apart, then when putitng it back together, the sealing process must be flawless. If not, condensation problem will occur.
You dont want your cool hid headlamp to have water vapors in it, do you?
Lots of work.? oh yea. Worth it? oh yea baby. |
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| Eric L. |
| Maybe it really would be easier to just add the stock HIDs to the system. |
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| RandyMax |
I heard all retrofitted HIDs are illegal.
Check your state law... if you care, that is... ;) |
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| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by RandyMax
I heard all retrofitted HIDs are illegal.
Check your state law... if you care, that is... ;)
You are correct. Unless you get a properly aimed projector (which is a sealed unit) or a reflector unit made for HID's sharp cutoff, then any other HID retrofit is illegal. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
then there is no difference between the oem and the retrofit.
Of course, if you reftrofit it improperly like: fitting rebased HID D2S bulb kit into current halogen enclosure, this is illegal!
Cops, will not caught you, as they most likely will not have a clueh what is the 'right ' HID and wrong 'hid'. But if you are involve in an accident and this improper retrofit of HID is the one causing the accident (too much glare, blinding etc), then you can be sued.
So, if one does retrofit HID, be carefull ~ When i say proper, it means:
- use hi quality bi-xenon projectors in your halogen headlamp. These are the cause for the bluish difrraction of HID beam. Not the blue bulb those honda rice boy put into their heavily mod civic!
- properly aim your HID with proper cut off ________/-------------
- elimnate the reflector surface in your current halogen headlamp.
hence mute the 'glare-problem'
- must not loose your hi -beam (this mute the fitting of rebased HID kit, because if you use 9007 HID kit, you will loose hi beam).
NO DUAL FILAMENT HID BEAM EXIST OUT THERE.
UNlike 9007 halogen bulb, it is dual filament right?
- buy hi-quality ballast like philips or hella so that it wil shutt off by itself during accident/impact, hence no electric shock potential.
Philips and hella ballast are used in most oem xenon: audi, bmw, mercedez
- safely mount the ballast per oem spec
- put relays and proper wiring harness between power source VDC and the ballast
Sound like oem ? :rolleyes: oh yeah... The cost: i did it on my audi, cost around $1,100. Hope this eliminate the hesistation to retrofit! |
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| jack |
quote:
Originally posted by yoyash
http://faq.auto.light.tripod.com/
This is a good site....
I have a Murano SL 04 that i purchase 1 month ago.. Even before purchasing my murano i was bidding on a set of headlight HID assembly from a murano SE .. Now that i have then, what do i do to make them work.. I did not know about the manual adjustment inside.. I would like someone here to tell me if this is possible to acheive HID on an SL.. I was under the impression that they would plug and play.. please remember these lights are OEM HID light all complete , it's the whole thing, my only concern is wether that will work.
I am more than interested to hear any stories.. There must be a way.. ?:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :D |
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| SugarRushMurano |
| perhaps it is close, i can swing by and bring all the wiring diagram with me. I am interested in making this work. |
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| jaak |
Ah, I corrupted you, now you spell jack as jaak!
;) |
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| SugarRushMurano |
| I just notice that jack is the new-guy. |
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| ekaxel |
I just looked at the manual- wiring, fuses etc for both xenon and conventional. They look exactly the same.
Jaak-PM me when you are coming to Portland. |
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| jack |
I am impressed .. I really appreciate the help i am getitng so far..
The dealer here in SK, regina, has some of the worst service dept i have even seen. I also own a Mercedes ML and by far benz is far superior.. enough about the service.. Nissan here sucks.. I had installed from brand new a front deflector and now my chrome grill is scratched.. I think it's going to be a battle:3: to have them change it.. i;ll keep everyone posted on this one.. |
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| jaak |
Hey Jack, good to meet you.... For the longest time, I didn't know Jack, but now I can say I do!
Now, this might be a local expression, but if you say you don't know Jack, it's like saying you don't know anything. (For those of you who didn't get it...)
Portland? I'm there the third week of June for new product training. I work for some old company based out of Beaverton... |
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| jack |
[COLOR=indigo]:claphead: Update.. I have Swapped My Halogen Headlights from My 2004 MO SL and I must assure everyone here that this was the simplest swap I have even done.. I removed the Regular Halogen Headlight and simply installed the NEW Headlight assembly .. Plugged right in no mods, cuttings or anything had to be done.. I didn't even changed the Fuses..
I am so Happy.. furthermore, I installed 8500K HID bulbs, looks awesome.
:7: |
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| hfelknor |
"I work for some old company based out of Beaverton..."
Would that be TekTronix?
Homer |
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| jack |
:3: I have a little problem. the high beams are not working @ all
I might have to look @ some wiring or fuses..
I'll be working on it!:( |
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| muranosl |
jack, i'm interested in doing a conversion too for my 04 sl.
can you tell me which brand you went with?
i've heard about losing the high beams on some brands of after market HIDs. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
To clarify for those of you who did not follow this thread:
Jack retrofit on HId does not use any aftermarket part.
He bought OEM xenon projector headlight (bulb and balast included) and do a complete swap on oem halogen. A true advanturer indeed. :cool:
quote:
JACK wrote:
update on HID Swap
I have a little problem. the high beams are not working @ all
I might have to look @ some wiring or fuses..
I'll be working on it!
I analyzed the wiring diagram of halogen versus xenon type from the repair manual. Open page: LT-9 and LT-59.
See under the subheading "High Beam Operation/Flash-to-pass operation". Compare them side by side, you will see the difference.
Under xenon type (LT-9), there are 6 extra bullets more than the halogen.
* to 15A fuse (no 83) in IPDM E/R
* through IPDM E/R terminal 27
* ...
* ...
* ...
* to headlamp LH terminal 4
This six extra bullets match exactly to the 6 bullets of the subsection "LOW BEAM OPERATION" <same page in LT-9 and LT59>
For HID, the IPDM will power HID bulb continuously. Hence, by activating hi beam from the light switch, you activated the projector shutter inside the headlight.
In your retrofit from halogen, when you activated the hi beam, the power to the HID-bulb is cut off by the IPDM E/R. Hence eventhough the shutter in the healight flip to hi-beam mode, you have no light source coming out. Thus, you loose your hi beam.
Now there are several things we can try to take care of this problem:
- the hi relay coil and low relay coil must be modified, so that the IPDM will provide power continuously the the D2S bulb.
or
- the IPDM e/r for halogen and xenon are *indeed* different. This is bad because it means that you must re -program / modify the ipdm ER to power the bulb continuosly or
- get new xenon compatible IPDM E/R ... $$$
IPDM E/R = inteligent power distribution module engine room.
Someone who has part list for murano for this IPDM E/R , can you check it out whether there are diferences in for our murano between ones with xenon and ones without?
I am getting my oil change soon, so i might ask the parts dept.
Will keep you updated on the topic. :2: |
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| ekaxel |
Good man Sugar! Wiring the same computer output different.
I guess you could add relaying on the OUTPUT (to stay away from the computer) to cross connect the shutter (high) output with the bulb(low) output to keep it on.
I just roughed it out. It will take 2 relays, 2 fuse holders and 6 wire connections in the epdm harness. Very similar in concept and degree of difficulty to my DRL hack posted earlier. People who do this may want to put the drl in at the same time (3 of the 6 connections are the same!)
Detailed schematic with wire color/id coming. |
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| jack |
:6: I am listening.. thanks you so much.. I am not really interested in going to the dealer to have this done. I am looking @ your comments daily thanks..
JAck:confused: |
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| ekaxel |
| Here is the hack. All wiring accessible in the EPDM harness (RH side of engine compartment). Fuses 15A |
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| jack |
:confused.. I hope I'll be able to do this.. It doesn't look too hard.. I'll give it a try.. Do I need anything else to make this work?
I'll print is out and show it to some friends.. What is the DRL? |
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| ekaxel |
| DRL is the addition of Daytime running lights left out in the US car. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
you are the man :D
Thanks for the diagram. I will also try that, along with Jack.
Jack, i read your email to me.
Do you happen to have the factory maintenance manual?
I am thinking of scanning some of the page (per your request in the email), but if you already have it, i will just quote the page # |
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| ekaxel |
| I goofed and left the fuses out. Needs a 15 amp fuse in each battery feed, just like the original. |
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| jack |
I don't have the manual in question.. I would appreciate so much if you could send me the appropriate pages either via e-mail or this web site..
How did you come by getting this manual and where ,if possible, can i purchase one.. thank you so much..I really really appreciate the help.. I owe you guys.. |
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| ekaxel |
| Been said before - I recommend soldering all connections. Don't use those plastic squeeze connectors. They are notoriously unreliable. |
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| jaak |
quote:
Originally posted by ekaxel
Here is the hack. All wiring accessible in the EPDM harness (RH side of engine compartment). Fuses 15A
You might be able to acheive what you want with the addition of one diode in the right spot.... |
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| ekaxel |
I agree with the theory, but in order to do this, you must disassemble and modify the EPDM board. A little more risky in terms of an EPDM failure/warranty issue.
I think I would do it. |
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| CopperKat |
jack
Here's how to obtain the service manual . . .
Manual  |
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| ekaxel |
| Re: Service Manual. Download is only practical if you have a broadband connection. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
quote:
Good man Sugar! Wiring the same computer output different.
Do you concure with my theory explaining jack's lost-of-hi-beam?
(since you retrofited DRl to Mo, so i guess you are the healidhgt-wiring-expert here :) |
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| ekaxel |
| You are absolutely right. Jaak's solution is simpler, mine less risky. I personally would use Jaak's, but for a lot of folks, it would be tough. |
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| ekaxel |
More tech stuff, concerns:
Jaak's method
1. Finding the right relay terminals once you have dissasembled the EPDM. Note: Relays are soldered in, so you have to do it on the bottom of the board.
Two of the four relay terminals are battery- should be big traces. Easy to spot
Third trace is the output to the fuse. Also a big trace -easy to spot.
The fourth terminal is the output of the processor. Ground signal line. Should be a small trace. This is the one you want.
So far so good.
Now the bad news: you will be putting a double load on the High beam output. Has to pull two relay coils instead of one. Possibility of frying that output. Big coin repair -no warranty.
If both the high and low beam relays are energized at the same time on a conventional headlight vehicle (which is what you are forcing), this is a no-no. May (and I emphazize MAY) set an error code in the diagnostic computer.
Have I scared you off this one yet?? |
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| jack |
::13: Now I am scared..
Where is the EPDM. and will i be able to remove the board off the car? What kind of resistor (ohm's) or connection will I have make to do this. I will take some pictures so i can share what i am doing.. this should be fun!
thanks
PS.. I really enjoy this site.. Great job!:4: |
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| jack |
| :D As per requested. Picture of the cut outlines of HID Headlights |
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| jack |
| Here are some of the pictures of where the Fuses are and (relays??) might be for the Headlight.. I would like to know if i am on the right track to finding the relay in question. |
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| jack |
| My Murano SL 04 with the NEW HID's 8500K bulbs.. Still no High beams, :2: |
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| ekaxel |
You do have a picture of the EPDM. If I were you, I wouldn't touch it without a shop manual. (and some basic knowledge of auto electronics and electronic repair).
Please see my PM |
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| jaak |
I agree, while it's simpler in theory to drop in a diode, it's not for those that aren't comfortable with electronics.
As far as dealing with the drivers and the relays, this could be done before the drivers which would solve the current sink concerns.
And yes, it would keep the low beams on, when going to the high beams, but that's the point of the modification when going to HID's.
For most, doing the external relays would be easier and less risky. If you cook your module there, you'd have to pull out that mod, just the same as the diode mod, before you'd have a chance at a warranty claim. |
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| ekaxel |
| Drivers are part of the computer IC inside the EPDM, controlled by software. You can't get at them. |
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| jaak |
| Well that's annoying... Kind of stupid too as a relay problem will take it out. I guess they figure anything goes wrong with it they trash it and make you buy a new one. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
First question for ekaxel:
------------------------------
quote:
Now the bad news: you will be putting a double load on the High beam output. Has to pull two relay coils instead of one. Possibility of frying that output. Big coin repair -no warranty.
....
Have I scared you off this one yet??
> "You will be putting a double load on the High beam output."
Is this true if we do either the external-relay-method (ekaxel's way) or the internal-relay (jaak's)? Sorry i am not too good in electronics.
>"If both the high and low beam relays are energized at the same time on a conventional headlight vehicle (which is what you are forcing), this is a no-no"
This will only happen with jaak's method right?
I am thinking of doing the external relay method per ekaxel's
Question for Jaak:
------------------
>"As far as dealing with the drivers and the relays, this could be done before the drivers which would solve the current sink concerns."
What did you mean by *done before the drivers hence solve the current sink problem*?
Sorry, I am not too good with electronics. It has been quite a while :) |
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| ekaxel |
1. external relays do not put any load on the EPDM drivers.
2. both internal relays energized only with Jaak's mod
3. I told Jaak in a PM that the drivers were an integral part of the EPDM computer chip and were not accessible. |
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| jaak |
This could also be acheived with a pair of diodes off the existing relays, driving an outboard relay, which would keep the parts count down, work and sidestep any issues with the module modification. It also relieves the relays of any current issues.
The high beam relay would still trip the shutter and the two diodes, one from high and low, would feed the relay that powers the HID's.
Keeps it simple. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
including the d2s xenon bulb last weekend.
Took me around 2.5 hrs with all the proper tools
and some tips from Jack (who did this retrofit 3 weeks ahead of me)
IT WORKS!
Overall, i think this is a better 'retrofit' for halogen murano then using aftermarket HID kit (rebased 9007 bulb base).
FYI, oem healdight (and hid bulb) is obtainable from ebay for around 50% or even less than dealer price.
Me and Jack are in the process of figuring the hi-beam (see earlier posts under this same thread). It turns out that the IPDM CPU of halogen murano are programed by FUJI-san ( !:rolleyes: ) in a slightly different way than HID muranos. But a simple relay circuit will solve this problem. I will post picture sometimes this coming weekend, once the relay is installed and hi-beam is set.
Let me say it one more time:
"Halogen to OEM HID system for murano DOES WORK". |
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| mattsmurano |
| Approximately how much $? |
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| SugarRushMurano |
| They dont cost that much because not many people are interested in them :D |
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| jack |
I paid 65.XXus(w/o the bulb) for one and the other 200us(w bulb)... not bad .. and of course the ampifier.. i would recommend the retrofit to anyone.. looks awesome.. I upgraded my bulbs to 8500K HID, super blue..
SugarRushMurano and myself are trying to get the High beams to work so We should figure things out in a few days..
For the Headlights,, Well on e-bay these days, the price hovers around 200.00 each usuallly in very good condition and complet with bulds and so one (plug and play type of thing)..
JAck
:) |
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| ekaxel |
I have a driver's side available at $175US shipped (within the US).
Complete, tested, with new D2S bulb (OEM 4300K) |
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| senza |
| I installed the "cheap blue bulbs" (fake HID lights)...I had removed them from my '01 Durango....surprised they used same bulbs(9007) ...easy to install topside...removed top half air cleaner box for driver's side....coolant overflow tank for passenger side...the more little projects I do, the more impressed I am with MO quality for little things..eg coolant overflow tank...in previous vehicles this would be installed with cheap self tapping phillips screws into plastic or cheap metal clips....Mo's tank held by 2 fine threaded 10mm bolts ; one into the top of the motor mount assembly; the other into a strong bracket with machined threads....quality... |
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| SugarRushMurano |
I installed them on my other 2 cars, burnt the wiring/relays/switch of the car. And since the damage is caused by aftermarket part, then it is not covered under warranty. So be careful.
Those bulb draws too much constant current to achieve its white-bluish output. And since they use filament, and you are burning it at higher temp, the life of the bulb will be shorter then regular 9007 halogen bulb.
Of course, if you installed the Sylvania Sylverstar or Philip Blue Vision, then they are supposed to be ok. Aside from the fact that they are not cheap around $50 a pair, their 'current-draw' properties have been tested againts oem wiring. <Can anyone can confirm this?>
Why dont go HID? $400ish is what you will spend (from ebay) and it looks way cool.
You can even sell the halogen headlight housing to a junkyard for around $100 a pair, this will help you cover a portion of the $400 cost. Just my accounting here ;) |
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| senza |
| SugarRush - Being electrically "challenged", wouldn't a fuse blow before wiring/switches,etc melt because the "cheap blue bulbs" draw too much current?...they have lasted 3 years in previous vehicle...cost approx. $75CAN...don't really improve lighting at all..just a whiter light... |
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| SugarRushMurano |
quote:
SugarRush - Being electrically "challenged", wouldn't a fuse blow before wiring/switches,etc melt because the "cheap blue bulbs" draw too much current?...
It depends on the current draw of the bulb and the design of the vehicle wiring/relays/switch ampere tolerance.
FORMULA : Power = voltage * current (P= V * I)
Fact1:
Let say your fuse is a 10amp fuse. This means that if the current is more than 10 amp, the fuse will open circuit (disconnect) right?
Fact2:
Let say regular 9007 halogen bulb needs 4 amp.
Hence the regular 9007 bulb will need power = 4*12volt = 48watt. The factory lighting system (switch/relays) is designed to withstand that much current draw (plus minus a small tolerance) let say up to 6 amp.
Fact3:
You buy a blue bulb that is 110 watt, so that it burns brighter. Fine. How much current this will draw? Using the above formula, it will burn 110 watt /12 volt = 9.1 amp. Sure it is still below the 10amp right? Your fuse will not blow out, and you are ok.
But a constant current draw of 9.1amp which is awfully close to the 10 amp limit, will cause the wiring/relay become hot, and overtime it will burnt out.
This is what happen to me, twice. :mad:
There are ppl who beefed up the wiring on their vehicle, replacing the switches and relays and wirings so that they can handle higher wattage bulb. This is, believe to be, the safest solution for the 'white-blue-bulb' current draw.
Hope this is helpful. |
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| senza |
| SugarRush - thanks for the in depth info...I still have the container the "blue bulbs" came in...I'll check the specs to see if there could be a problem... |
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| Halo |
Blue bulbs :thumbsdown:
Look, everyone else by now can tell that they're not HID. They don't provide the same light output of HID, in fact they give worse overall output than clear bulbs of the same wattage. So, at this point (say 3-4 years after the ricers started pimping these things) it's safe to say that blue bulbs are not the way to go in your headlights. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
Remember the external relay solution that you provided under this same thread to get the hi-beam in my oem hid retrofit project?
I am just wondering where can i pull the batery power connection (with 15 amp fuse) into the external relays per your diagram.
The wiring inside the IPDM for the hot-cable (positive) is very thick and hence i dont think splicing it is a good idea.
Hence, after analysing the wiring and pinouts diagram from murano service manual, page PG-43, i come to the consluison that i can use pin #19 or 34. They are unused and what i need to do is to replace fuse #89 or #90 with 15amp.
Am i correct? Thanks.
Pic attached |
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| SugarRushMurano |
for thse who are interested, you can find it here:
My Gallery |
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| MO in TO |
| Was there ever a relatively easy resolution to getting the high beams to work in an OEM swapout from halogen to Xenon? Do you know if I also need a "computerized high voltage headlight control module" as is listed in an ebay auction? |
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| zebelkhan |
quote:
Originally posted by MO in TO
Was there ever a relatively easy resolution to getting the high beams to work in an OEM swapout from halogen to Xenon? Do you know if I also need a "computerized high voltage headlight control module" as is listed in an ebay auction?
Yes. Unfortunately off of the top of my head I do not remember who the member was who did it and provided "how to install" pictures of it. I do remember SugarRush e-mailed them to me and I still have them at home. I will try to look them up for you and even post them in the gallery (with proper credits of course). Please PM me if I forget to do it...:)
Edit: the high beam works with wiring a couple of relays. No need for the e-bay stuff. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
I formatted my pcs and hence i requested zebelkhan to resend it to me. All i have are hard copies and if i scan them, it will look sligh blurry.
Again: The hi beam *will* work with simple relay mod. |
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| zebelkhan |
SugarRush,
E-mailed the pics to you. please let me know if you don't get them. Also, I went ahead and posted the pics in my gallery but I can't give proper credit to the owner of the pictures because unfortunately I still do not remember If you remember who the original person was that did this mod and provided these pictures please let me know so I can give him the credit. |
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| MO in TO |
| This update is really appreciated. Thanks for the super-quick input!:) |
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| MO in TO |
Ok, so amongst my excessive Ebay bids and buys, I now have three OEM HID housings, and three complete wiring harnesses, one set to be sold off at a later date. Two questions I have, before I tackle the upgrade, are:
1. Has anyone installed the interior control I have read about that comes in an SE for aiming the headlights? I notice there is a coil attached to the projectors that appears to have the ability to move the assembly left and right, while the height level is manually adjusted from what I can tell and read in other posts using the small white plastic screw on the housings. Is it necessary to install an interior control as well?
2. Does the fact that I have Canadian daytime running lights affect the headlight relay wiring needed? Canadian DTRL's are the lower bumper driving lamps, so I suspect not, but want to make sure.
Stay tuned for pics of my aftermarket Katzkin complete leather interior just installed today in their 'Autumn' color, very close to OEM for 2003, plus my black chrome SE rims on their way up from California soon. :2: |
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| jaak |
I don't know how much of the wiring is in there, but if you pull off the panel on the left side, below the vent, you'll see the connectors for the switches, taped up inside the dash.
I've not pursued it, but I've often wondered, if that's there, what about the rest of the HID wiring? |
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| SugarRushMurano |
quote:
MO in TO:
Has anyone installed the interior control I have read about that comes in an SE for aiming the headlights? I notice there is a coil attached to the projectors that appears to have the ability to move the assembly left and right, while the height level is manually adjusted from what I can tell and read in other posts using the small white plastic screw on the housings. Is it necessary to install an interior control as well?
Jaak:
I've not pursued it, but I've often wondered, if that's there, what about the rest of the HID wiring?
Jaak, the interior aiming leveler wiring for a murano that has no HID *is not* there. Even the IPDM control modules are different.
So far there are 3 version of IPDM: one for base murano, one for medium loaded murano (with VDC and HID) and one for fully loaded murano (VDC HID NAV). Retrofitting the auto leveler inside the cabin on a base murano will be very challenging as the wiring and the electronic control module must be retrofited as well.
Yet, for "MO-inTO", dont worry! This should not discourage you to retrofit that oem HID headlights. IMHO you dont really need the autoleveler. I have several vehicles before murano that have HID but no leveler feature in the cabin. There is a small plastic screw behidn the headlight to adjust the aiming of the HID beam. I used that one to aim my HID properly after retrofit. So far, no one flash their headlight!
The purpose of the in cabin leveler is not to substitute the small white screws' function. Anyway, only a small vertical angle of the HID cut off beam is changed if you use the in cabin leveler for adjusting headlight.
Example 1:
Let say you go to The Homedepot and get 90lbs of concrete and haul it home, it will lowered your murano right? So you can raise the headlight beam by using the leveler instead of opening the engine bay and use the plastic screw. Then you can raise it back up once you unload all those loads fromk the murano, again using the leveler.
Example 2:
Imagine if you are driving on a hilly roads, at night. Sometimes by raising the headlight further (higher) will provide better plane of view behind that roadbend at the back of that steep downhill.
Instead of you having to stop in the middle of nowhere, adjust the beam using the screw in the engine bay, you use the leveler to raise your beam. |
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| jaak |
Hmmm.... I'll have to take a picture of what I'm talking about, as it really does look like it's there on mine. It's quite possible that they have different harnesses in different Muranos.. Could be 'cause mine's an '03 or Canadian, or first build, or a mistake, or whatever.
I'll take the pic, then cross reference it to the service manual as it's got diagrams of all the harnesses. I've never actually checked it out before. But there's two unused connectors right behind there, but taped up onto part of the dash. |
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| jaak |
| If you pull the cover off on the left side (it just pulls straight off) and look inside and up, you may find two cables taped up to the inside of the dash. Pull off the tape and here's what you get (at least on my 2003 SL): |
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| jaak |
| One of them's four conductors... Hmmm.. Looks familiar... |
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| jaak |
| Looking at the harness, it appears I have wiring for VDC as well. |
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| zebelkhan |
| Just checked my 04 SL. I have the wires too....:) |
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| jaak |
| There's the VDC. Funny, they only use four conductors on that connector of six. |
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| MO in TO |
Zebelkhan or SugarRushMurano (or others), I have completed my OEM HID swap today, and installed the relay according to the pics Zebelkhan linked to earlier in this thread. The install went well, about 3 hours total, but when I powered up to test, I have everything except high beams functioning. When I move the stalk to activate high beams, it cuts OFF the headlights as well as the DTRL's, and only the turn signals still work.
I had bought a standard automative 12V relay, with the same standard schematic as in the image 'step 2'. The only odd thing that did not match was that the relay diagram I have on the package shows #85 to ground, #30 fused power from battery, #86 to switching means and #87 (and 87A) as power to lamps.
Zebelkhan's gallery shows #87 as power from battery, #86 to ground, #30 to the spliced solid red on ONE of the HID harnesses (I used the drivers side only), and #85 spliced to the red striped wire on the same harness. This is how I hooked it all up.
Is the way I installed it actually correct and has it been verifed for accuracy? Does the fact that my MO is Canadian with DTRL's have anything to do with no high beams still? (Maybe I need another mod?)
As an afterthought, should I actually install a 15A fuse inline with the battery to the relay?
Help would be appreciated. I don't want to try swapping the terminals around for concern of cooking something.:confused: |
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| ekaxel |
I am not absolutely sure which is which as I sit here, but I think 87a is a normally closed contact, usually in the center of the relay. You don't want to use that one. Only use the four around the outside, as you want normally open on both relays.
Also make sure that the manual you are using (or the info from Z is for the right year car) is the one that matches your car. There are differences |
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| MO in TO |
| ekaxel, thanks, yes 87a is a normally closed contact in the centre and I am not using it. #85 and #86 are the coil. It seems to me that the intention is for the power normally sent to the high beam filament on a halogen lamp is meant to be redirected to power the coil, and close the contacts sending 12V to the coils that control the shutters on the HID setups. I may be wrong in my thoughts though. I can't wrap my head around why only one relay is required on one side only. Something is still incomplete here (at least for vehicles with OEM DTRL's) and I hope someone has a fix. I tried to send an email to Jack (Canada) who did a HID conversion on a Canada build earlier in this thread, but it bounced back. :bonk: |
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| ekaxel |
| You have it backward. What the two relays are intended to do is to send power to the bulb in the hi beam position. The normal high beam bulb wiring energizes the shutter. There are two relays to keep the left and right isolated is they normally are. |
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| MO in TO |
| ekaxel, are you suggesting I may need two relays instead of just one? Please refer to the pics linked to in zebelkhan's gallery link a page or two up. It says only one side needs to be modified?:confused: |
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| ekaxel |
| I can't find Z's. Mine (the hasndscratched one) shows two relays. That's all I know. |
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| zebelkhan |
I am sorry I can't be any help because I have not done an HID mod myself. But I remember when it was done by some members back then it worked for them. Maybe SugarRush can shed some light on this. I think he has done it.
My light mod was to install a DTRL, using ekaxel's plan. That used two relays but the HID conversion uses only one relay on one side. ekaxel could be right though as wiring maybe different on yours.
BTW, here is what I think ekaxel is thinking about. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
quote:
MO in TO:
Zebelkhan's gallery shows #87 as power from battery, #86 to ground, #30 to the spliced solid red on ONE of the HID harnesses (I used the drivers side only), and #85 spliced to the red striped wire on the same harness. This is how I hooked it all up. Is the way I installed it actually correct and has it been verifed for accuracy? Does the fact that my MO is Canadian with DTRL's have anything to do with no high beams still? (Maybe I need another mod?)As an afterthought, should I actually install a 15A fuse inline with the battery to the relay?
Sorry for being late in the game, i was travelling.
Anyway, i do not have the diagram here with me right now, but when I am off from work and got the chance to refer to my notes at home, i will post again and try to answer.
You only need *one* relay to make the hibeam work if you use zebelkhan's galerry as reference. Either side is fine: driver or passanger side, BUT NOT BOTH!!!
If you use Ekaxel's diagram, you will need 2 relays. I was planning to do his method but in the end I adopt the 'one-relay' method. Much cleaner and simpler.
Jack, also from Canada, sucessfully integrate 'one relay' hi beam mod to his HID swap. I sucessfully installed the 'one-relay-mod' to the USA version HID with no DTRLs and the hi beam do work.
So i dont think DTRL is causing it. So YES! This 'one relay method' has been verified.
Two things you can do while waiting:
1.
For now, my suggestion to you: install that 15A fuse between the baterry and relay just for short protection and fire precaution! But with or without the fuse, it still wont solve this no hi beam problem.
2.
Have you test the relay? Maybe it is a damage relay?
Get a new one and give it a try perhaps?
I will post again tonight.... |
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| MO in TO |
| Hey SRM, thanks for jumping in, if you have any more thoughts I would love to hear them. I will definitely install the in-line fuse for protection, and will test the relay. I know I can hear a relay clicking in and out when I activate the stalk, but the contacts could be bad even though the part is new. Or could this noise be the coils on the shutters themselves? Can anyone with OEM HID's confirm if the shutter noise is audible enough to hear it in the cabin, assuming ambient noise is minimal? I drove last night with my Xenon's and really, really love the improvement in illumination, especially as my eyesight gets worse. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
Let's not talk about the details in the forum and create heavy forum traffics... PM me and give me your email address. We should chat via email.
From what you said:
quote:
I can't wrap my head around why only one relay is required on one side only.
THis is pretty simple, see the diagram of murano with standard halogen in the service manual page LT-82. The left lo-beam wire is in series with the right lo-beam. If you connect the left one and provide a voltage source, it will create a close circuit and it will transmit current to both side of the lo-beam, passing the lo beam filament to the ground.
The halogen headlight system by default turn off the lo beam filament and energize the hi-beam filament in the bulb.
The oem xenon headlight system by default energize both lo and hi beam wires: one to keep the HID bulb lights up, one to move the shutter in the headlight housing....
That is why we need a relay to trick the halogen headlight system to energize both the lo and hi-beam wires when you flick the hi beam stalk inside the MO.
quote:
I had bought a standard automative 12V relay, with the same standard schematic as in the image 'step 2'. The only odd thing that did not match was that the relay diagram I have on the package shows #85 to ground, #30 fused power from battery, #86 to switching means and #87 (and 87A) as power to lamps.
I need you to send the pic of the relay diagram. I think this is the culprit. That is why we should chat via email. Hear form you again. |
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| ekaxel |
Re: "one relay"
Using only one relay puts both bulbs on the same fuse. Yes it works, but eliminates all the isolation and separate fusing that Nissan designed in. Creates a single point of failure for BOTH headlights. |
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| SugarRushMurano |
I am in the middle of helping "MO IN TO" and try to figure out why his one relay mod not able to output the hi beam. What i am interested in is comparing the wiring headlight wiring diagram on page LT-82 and LT-83 of the factory service manual between the one with the DTRL and the one without.
I have the factory service manual for the 03, USA version. Hence no DTRL. Help is appreciated~ |
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| jaak |
| As far as I know, it's the same service manual for both... |
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| MO in TO |
| With particlarly notable thanks to SugarRushMurano (kind enough to share his time and exchange private emails), as well as from ekaxel, zeblekhan and jaak, I have solved my dilemma! As it turns out, there is no difference between Canadian built and US built Muranos, when it comes to OEM headlight conversions. Upon SRM's advice and after troubleshooting just about everything except my splices, (which I was sure were perfect because I had checked them with a continuity meter during installation), I decided to pop open the inside wheel well cover and inspect my nicely taped up splices. The plastic connectors I had purchased did a lousy job, and the splice to the solid red wire was not making full contact. I removed both, soldered the connections, closed it up and BINGO, low and high beams! The word of the day is ----NEVER use crappy plastic splice connectors beacuse they are easy, always take the time to solder your add-on connections!---Thanks to all, this worked great and I am really pleased!:2: |
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| SugarRushMurano |
quote:
. Upon SRM's advice and after troubleshooting just about everything except my splices, (which I was sure were perfect because I had checked them with a continuity meter during installation), I decided to pop open the inside wheel well cover and inspect my nicely taped up splices. The plastic connectors I had purchased did a lousy job, and the splice to the solid red wire was not making full contact. I removed both, soldered the connections, closed it up and BINGO, low and high beams! The word of the day is ----NEVER use crappy plastic splice connectors beacuse they are easy, always take the time to solder your add-on connections!---Thanks to all, this worked great and I am really pleased!
Good to know that it all work out for you.
Hope this will encourage more people to do the conversion in a heart beat....
Once you go HId, i guarantee you will never want to go back to halogen :4: |
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| zebelkhan |
| Well done! congratulations....and make sure you post pictures of your mod. :) |
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| virux |
i'd like to get the instructions on how to retrofit the oem HID's into my halogens as well ;)
Thanks |
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| MO in TO |
| virux, since this thread has become rather difficult to read through for clear cut directions, I am in the process of taking some additional pictures, and organizing an easy to understand compilation of the instructions to do this, which I will post on the forum as a new thread within a couple of days. I will make sure that all of those that have contributed to the process thus far are acknowledged, especially where I will need to link to additional images in a couple of locations.:) |
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| SugarRushMurano |
Thanks for thaking the innitiative.. I appreciate it.
quote:
Full instructions on the way!
virux, since this thread has become rather difficult to read through for clear cut directions, I am in the process of taking some additional pictures, and organizing an easy to understand compilation of the instructions to do this, which I will post on the forum as a new thread within a couple of days. I will make sure that all of those that have contributed to the process thus far are acknowledged, especially where I will need to link to additional images in a couple of locations.
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| MO in TO |
If you refer to this threadyou will find full instructions on how to do this simple conversion!
Cheers! :2: |
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| MichaelMurano |
| It doesn't sound like you know what you're doing Dulsux. You should leave them the way they are. :) |
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| SugarRushMurano |
quote:
MichaelMurano wrote:
It doesn't sound like you know what you're doing Dulsux. You should leave them the way they are.
Am I missing something? What is this about? ;) |
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