| Jim C |
From Nissan North America . . .
2003 – 2005 Murano Alternator Voluntary Safety Recall Campaign
Background
Nissan will be conducting a voluntary safety recall campaign on selected 2003-2005 model year Murano vehicles for a potential wire failure within the alternator.
Affected Vehicles
Distributor Model Model Year Approximate Build
Date Range Approximate
Number of Vehicles
NNA Murano 2005 April 8, 2002 (SOP) – September 24, 2004 125,500
NCI Murano 2005 April 8, 2002 (SOP) – September 24, 2004 15,300
Total 140,800
Affected Markets
This voluntary safety recall campaign only affects vehicles sold in the U.S. and Canada.
Reason for Action
An open circuit in the alternator can occur due to wire fatigue caused by movement of the rotor coil during rapid changes in engine speed in vehicles equipped with a continuously variable transmission (CVT).
When an open circuit occurs in the alternator, the charge warning and brake warning lamps come on. If a driver does not seek repair of the vehicle immediately as instructed in the Owners Manual and continues to drive the vehicle in this condition, the vehicle will operate normally for about one hour. After this time period, the battery voltage will drop to a level that causes the engine control module to go into a fail safe mode. During fail safe mode, which lasts about ten minutes, vehicle speed will be reduced due to the throttle plate being held in a fixed position. After this time period, the engine will stop running. The fail safe mode provides a second obvious warning to the driver that there is a problem and that the driver should pull off the road as soon as possible and stop driving the vehicle. The actual speed of the vehicle will depend upon the speed of the vehicle when it went into the fail safe mode, the operation of the throttle pedal by the driver and the slope of the road. In some cases, vehicle speed during the fail safe mode may not be adequate to allow a driver to move safely to the side of the road or to exit a highway.
To date there have been no injuries related to this situation.
Nissan Action
Nissan will send owner notification letters beginning in August 2005 informing customers to bring their vehicle to a Nissan dealer for inspection. If necessary, the alternator will be replaced with a new version which has been modified to prevent movement of the coil.
Key Questions
Are other Nissan/Infiniti vehicles affected? No
Has NHTSA and Transport Canada been notified? Yes, DIR submitted
When will customers be contacted? August 2005
Have there been any injuries related to this issue? No
Does this affect vehicles in dealer inventory? Yes
Added by Eric L.: It's official. I've confirmed this as well with my contact at NHTSA. Nissan filed an official 573 recall notification July 12, 2005. Thanks to all Murano owners who contributed to NHTSA's recall investigation. |
|
|
| jaak |
Whoo Hoooooo!!!! Now that's a STICKY!!!
:18: :7: :18: :7: :18:
:21: :21:
:2: :2: :2: :2: :2: |
|
|
| jaak |
quote:
Originally posted by Jim C
Does this affect vehicles in dealer inventory? Yes
Interesting.... |
|
|
| pcs15394 |
| I wanted to thank everyone who reported the Alternator failures to the NHTSA . Obviously the consumers (us) had a very strong impact on forcing Nissan to face up to the problem. To all the Guys and Gals on this forum and the FA forum who reported the failures : |
|
|
| jaak |
A special thanks to Eric and zofsuvs for their relentless attention to this...
I've never had the fault, but it's good to know there's a chance I never will, if it's replaced/repaired under the recall.
Job well done!!!!!
:7: :7:
And thanks to Jim C. for breaking the news!!!! You know we would all hug you, but then we'd have to talk about sports immediately after and go drink beer. |
|
|
| KSmurano |
That's good news, its always been in the back of my mind when it was going to happen.
Especially since I'm approaching 36k miles & purchased my MO back in March 03!
But what is the difference between an NNA Murano & a NCI Murano? |
|
|
| Jim C |
NNA = Nissan North America - generally the U.S., including territories
NCI = Nissan Canada, Inc. - Canada and its territories.
Differences between the vehicles are minor (e.g., metric speedo/odo). |
|
|
| muggle |
| How do we find out if our replacements are the new and improved alternator? |
|
|
| CP-Mike |
| Got a link to official press release or something on a Nissan site? I'm guessing that unless I bring proof with me, my dealer is going to deny that there is a recall...right up until they mail out the notices. |
|
|
| jaak |
I would expect that the only proof that would be acceptable initially, would be the letter. That should be enough to keep them busy, and then they'll take care of the others that haven't received theirs.
Must be a bit of a nightmare dealing with the expected onrush, so they might meter out the letters so the dealers don't all of a sudden have tons of people lined up. (and no stock.) |
|
|
| Gonzo |
| And some thought it wouldn't happen..... hats off to Nissan for doing the right thing... finally. |
|
|
| Eric L. |
*clap clap clap clap*
At last!!! :) :) :) :) |
|
|
| zebelkhan |
Finally! Now we can have the alternator taken care of and go on long trips without worry....
Wonder if Nissan will refund the cost of repair to those who had to pay out of warrnty? |
|
|
| Corin |
I'll join everyone in saying thanks to everyone that reported the problem and to everyone that kept nagging everyone to report the problem. My mom was right, nagging DOES pay off eventually! :)
I'm very thankful that this came out BEFORE I had any problems. I'll have to check and see if mine needs it. If not, gives me peace of mind. If so, I'm heading out to my GOOD dealer to do the work, even though he's 100 miles away!
Of course, I'm heading out camping again this weekend, so hopefully it won't fail on me at that time... :rolleyes: |
|
|
| mimregi |
| I JUST had my alternator replaced yesterday!!! Fortunately the guy at the dealer was understanding enough to fudge my mileage and get the work and tow under factory warranty (we were at 37,028 when the alternator went), I just have to find out if the part he put in is the part getting recalled or if I got a "new and improved" alternator... |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by mimregi
I JUST had my alternator replaced yesterday!!! Fortunately the guy at the dealer was understanding enough to fudge my mileage and get the work and tow under factory warranty (we were at 37,028 when the alternator went), I just have to find out if the part he put in is the part getting recalled or if I got a "new and improved" alternator...
You can check your service invoice for the updated part number: 2310M-CN10AR |
|
|
| mimregi |
quote:
Originally posted by Eric L.
You can check your service invoice for the updated part number: 2310M-CN10AR
Oh, yeah. Very good thinking! If you don't mind my asking, where did you get the part number? i actually wasn't able to find official confirmation on the recall yet (not that I looked very hard -- I have learned to truest this site, I just was curious if it was posted to nissanusa.com yet, which it isn't).
Thanks! |
|
|
| mgthe3 |
Hot DAM!
I betcha nissanmurano.org had a huge input to this outcome.
I join Corin in thanking all who submitted their input to the proper authorities.
YAY! |
|
|
| Tyler_Canada |
quote:
Originally posted by mimregi
I JUST had my alternator replaced yesterday!!! Fortunately the guy at the dealer was understanding enough to fudge my mileage and get the work and tow under factory warranty (we were at 37,028 when the alternator went), I just have to find out if the part he put in is the part getting recalled or if I got a "new and improved" alternator...
Maybe I'm completely missing something, but isn't the warranty on the alternator 60,000 miles? |
|
|
| mimregi |
quote:
Originally posted by Tyler_Canada
Maybe I'm completely missing something, but isn't the warranty on the alternator 60,000 miles?
I _thought_ it was 36k, but you know what I could be wrong =/ the car isn't with me (I'm in MASS, car is in FL with my wife) and I didn't have the paperwork here, so it's certainly possible I am mistaken. |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by mimregi
Oh, yeah. Very good thinking! If you don't mind my asking, where did you get the part number? i actually wasn't able to find official confirmation on the recall yet (not that I looked very hard -- I have learned to truest this site, I just was curious if it was posted to nissanusa.com yet, which it isn't).
Thanks!
Linky |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by Tyler_Canada
Maybe I'm completely missing something, but isn't the warranty on the alternator 60,000 miles?
Bumper to bumper is 36,000 miles, and this is what the alternator falls under. 60,000 mils is the powertrain, which is basically the engine and transmission, but does not include accessories (alternator, AC, PS pump, etc...). |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
There was a problem with the alternators? ;) (Just kidding!)
Thanks to this great group and its terrific members for contributing to make this happen! :D
Special thanks to Eric. L. and SurgarRushMurano for their tireless devotion to the cause, and to all that participated in the Alternator Failure List, Eric's Alternator Failure Poll, or helped spread the word. You guys are the best! :D
Oh, and let's not forget the NHTSA! You guys have been patient and standfast in this investigation and very courteous and professional when contacting those of us here who have experienced alternator failures. You have saved a lot of people not only money and aggravation, but also potentially headed off an even more serious outcome. Hats off to the DOT/NHTSA/ODI! :claphead: :29: |
|
|
| Tyler_Canada |
quote:
Originally posted by Eric L.
Bumper to bumper is 36,000 miles, and this is what the alternator falls under. 60,000 mils is the powertrain, which is basically the engine and transmission, but does not include accessories (alternator, AC, PS pump, etc...).
OH! I thought it was under the powertrain, but my powertrain warranty is almost up too. |
|
|
| Gonzo |
| Hey did you hear, they just updated the recall to cover the power steering pump too. Nissan is going to incorporate the two into one "Altsteeringator. " The only thing is you have to keep turning the wheel to maintain electrical output...... |
|
|
| Eric L. |
| Before we all jump and make an appt with the Nissan dealer, remember that a recall announcement is not official (to the dealer) until you present notification from the manufacturer (usually a letter). Seeing how most Nissan dealers refuse to do warrantied work under normal conditions, I doubt you can convince them to replace your alternator until Nissan sends you a recall notice. The letters are usually mailed in batches, so dealers are not overwhelmed by recall vehicles. |
|
|
| Gonzo |
| You are right. Even though the notice will start in August it may be months after that before you get anything in the mail. |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
Eric, with the news now of a recall, I'd like to suggest the other alternator stickies be changed to regular "non-sticky" threads, and the focus given to this thread instead. Perhaps this should happen sooner than later to avoid an onslaught of duplicate or cross postings. What do you think?
The posts include my:
"Alternator Failure List" (zofsuvs)
"Your Vote Counts - Please Vote" (zofsuvs)
Stickies to also consider unsticking:
"Alternator Investigation Closed (Upgraded?)" (Richie)
"NHTSA investigation (updated) and test Murano needed" (Eric L.)
"Alternator failure poll" (Eric L.)
"Testing the Murano's Alternator" (Jaak)
I don't know about the "Brake & Battery Lights On Means Imminent Failure" thread, as it may be helpful as a warning until people are fully aware of the Recall thread. Thoughts? Thanks. |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by zofsuvs
Eric, with the news now of a recall, I'd like to suggest the other alternator stickies be changed to regular "non-sticky" threads, and the focus given to this thread instead. Perhaps this should happen sooner than later to avoid an onslaught of duplicate or cross postings. What do you think?
The posts include my:
"Alternator Failure List" (zofsuvs)
"Your Vote Counts - Please Vote" (zofsuvs)
Stickies to also consider unsticking:
"Alternator Investigation Closed (Upgraded?)" (Richie)
"NHTSA investigation (updated) and test Murano needed" (Eric L.)
"Alternator failure poll" (Eric L.)
"Testing the Murano's Alternator" (Jaak)
I don't know about the "Brake & Battery Lights On Means Imminent Failure" thread, as it may be helpful as a warning until people are fully aware of the Recall thread. Thoughts? Thanks.
I think its a good idea to leave these links up for a while since its a good history lesson on how group action can lead to a positive response from the manufacturer. They'll be unsticked eventually though, when reports of how the recall is coming along become more frequent. |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
Okay, but consider unsticking my "Alternator Failure List" and "Please vote" threads soon, though. I don't feel it's necessary to maintain the List any more, and my "Vote" thread isn't really needed anymore either. I'll let you guys decide on the others.
I would encourage people to post to this thread about the alternator recall from here on out, though, to make it easier to keep updated on the topic. |
|
|
| utah |
Does anyonw know from where they will pull the list of addresses to mail recall letters? Will the list come from purchase records, dealer service records, MyNissan.com?
I've recently moved, and I want to make sure I get my letter. I don't know how these things work.
Thanks |
|
|
| CP-Mike |
quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Tyler_Canada:
Maybe I'm completely missing something, but isn't the warranty on the alternator 60,000 miles?
Bumper to bumper is 36,000 miles, and this is what the alternator falls under. 60,000 mils is the powertrain, which is basically the engine and transmission, but does not include accessories (alternator, AC, PS pump, etc...).
So Nissan classifies the alternator as an "accessory"? Yeah, if you want to manually charge your battery from the wall everywhere you go. Also, isn't an alternator an essential part of the "power" in "powertrain"? What good is an engine that has nothing to power its spark plug for extended periods of time?
I know I'm wrong, but it's just frustrating that something essential like the alternator is not covered by the powertrain warranty |
|
|
| KSmurano |
CP-Mike I believe that's the way it works for most if not all automakers, no just Nissan.
It's the fine print of their lawyers! :3: |
|
|
| XOC |
quote:
Originally posted by zofsuvs
I don't know about the "Brake & Battery Lights On Means Imminent Failure" thread, as it may be helpful as a warning until people are fully aware of the Recall thread. Thoughts? Thanks.
I think the brake and battery light warning should definitely remain a sticky. It will be a long time before every Murano can get the new alternator. That sticky warning sure saved me a lot of aggravation last week. |
|
|
| SugarRushMurano |
quote:
zofsuvs says:
Thanks to this great group and its terrific members for contributing to make this happen! Special thanks to Eric. L. and SurgarRushMurano for their tireless devotion to the cause, and to all that participated in the Alternator Failure List, Eric's Alternator Failure Poll, or helped spread the word. You guys are the best!
Thank you for all the help and effort of ALL forum members!
This recall will not be possible without all of you..united we strong~
However, we should not let our guard down and close the 'alternator failure'topic . Not until NNA is indeed sending out those recall letters to owners (and not faking it) and not until there are forum members who report back after their alternators are replaced by dealers!
How much this recall going to cost Nissan?
My estimate = 150,000 murano * $500 avg/vehicle = 75 million bucks.
Oh my GOD~
Yet, I am going to celebrate tonight with my 6-pack...wohooo....:7:
You know, all nissanmurano.org members in tri-state area: VA-PA-MD-DC should get together ;)..at baltimore inner harbour hooters perhaps? :4:..Shoot me a pm! |
|
|
| Kris |
quote:
Originally posted by utah
Does anyonw know from where they will pull the list of addresses to mail recall letters? Will the list come from purchase records, dealer service records, MyNissan.com?
I've recently moved, and I want to make sure I get my letter. I don't know how these things work.
Thanks
Same here. i'd like to know. |
|
|
| SugarRushMurano |
quote:
Originally posted by Kris
Same here. i'd like to know.
Here is a thought.
In www.nissanusa.com there is the owner page. Click on the MY NISSAN and every nissan owner will be able to provide vin# to register their vehicle in NNA database. This will allow you to view all recall documents, managed maintenance records, enter their most current address/contatc info, link a prefered dealer and set a reminder on maintenance so that your dealer will call you when it is time (aproximate) and many more features.
I have done this since day 1 of my vehicle ownership.
So far it works as NNA says.
SO, I think Mo Owner should register and always maintain their up to date address in MY VEHICLE database. The recall letter will arrive either at your prefered dealer or at your home. ;) |
|
|
| Dave N |
"....during rapid changes in engine speed in vehicles equipped with a continuously variable transmission (CVT). "
Ummmm, isn't the entire point of a CVT to maintain a steady engine speed? :-P
I don't know about the rest of you, but unless I use the manual mode on my CVT, I don't experience any rapid changes in engine speed. I'm not saying that it isn't true, but I found that statement pretty humorous.
Carry on...:-)
Dave N. |
|
|
| Murano_driver |
Hey,
I was checking another tread and it seems like my MO is one with the bad alternator. I do not have a problem yet and I am on 28,000 miles, but I am doing a lot of trips to up state and I do not want to stuck there one day. So, how can I make my dealer to replace one? I check the nissanusa.com web site but there is no info on alternators recall. Thanks |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by Murano_driver
Hey,
I was checking another tread and it seems like my MO is one with the bad alternator. I do not have a problem yet and I am on 28,000 miles, but I am doing a lot of trips to up state and I do not want to stuck there one day. So, how can I make my dealer to replace one? I check the nissanusa.com web site but there is no info on alternators recall. Thanks
Nissan will begin mailing letters in August. Once you get your letter, take your car to the dealer and show them the letter. |
|
|
| ECH |
| I just had my alternator replaced TODAY...after being stranded last night in the country due to complete auto shutdown. My new fella has only 9400 miles on it... everything happened just as folks have described it. First, the brake and battery lights, then a few hrs. later, complete loss of "transmission", and then the dashboard freaked out, and total loss of electronics. The ironic thing is that I had a tire rotation/oil change scheduled for today. My '04 Murano had to be towed to the dealership for obviously more than the scheduled service. If I had not found this website while waiting for the service dept. to open this a.m., I would have spent a few hrs. frustrated and perplexed. Instead, I learned what was wrong before the service manager could tell me. Got it fixed, and fingers crossed, hopefully won't experience that same kind of desperation again! DEFINITELY, people, get this fixed ASAP. If I weren't on a country road when this happened, it could have been extremely dangerous. |
|
|
| hfelknor |
Dave
Unless your MO idles at 6000 RPM, how do you suppose it gets there?
Rapidly.
Almost instantaneous.
Quicker than any "normal" auto transmission model in the universe.
The Normal Engine connected to a normal tranny has to wait for the speed to build, the VQ connected to the CVT does not.
THAT's the rapid change in engine speed they are talking about.
A bit of an indication perhaps of each individuals driving habits?
Those of us who generally (nearly all the time) give it about 2000 RPM and then let the speed build might have less problems then
those who just NAIL it on a regular basis are moving the coil in the alternator ("jerking" it really) and that is why, although the same alternator is being used on several different cars, the problem seems to be mainly with Muranos.
The Altima for instance has the same alternator but it has a regular geared auto tranny.
It took Nissan a while to figure it out (understandably) but they are doing the right thing.
I will have to rethink some of my criticism' of the company.
Homer |
|
|
| Murano_driver |
quote:
Originally posted by Eric L.
Nissan will begin mailing letters in August. Once you get your letter, take your car to the dealer and show them the letter.
I went to different dealer’s location couple times of time, nothing major just oil change, wheel alignment etc, but I never received a survey from Nissan USA and the dealers told me that I should. So I am a little worrying about the recall letter now….. |
|
|
| jballchat |
quote:
[
It took Nissan a while to figure it out (understandably) but they are doing the right thing.
I will have to rethink some of my criticism' of the company.
[/B]
Seems like Nissan had this figured out back in September '04. Why did it take almost 10 months to issue a recall? |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by jballchat
Seems like Nissan had this figured out back in September '04. Why did it take almost 10 months to issue a recall?
I agree, they knew about this for a while and were apparently still putting in bad replacement alternators. But, yes, they are doing the right thing now... with a little encouragement from the NHTSA. Thank you Nissan. |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
I would like to add shappy0869's post from another thread to this one. (Hope that's okay shappy0869!) I think it may be helpful to keep this discussion in one thread as much as possible at the start so everyone can be updated on the latest news.
quote:
Originally posted by shappy0869
CAMPAIGN I.D. #: P5215
APPLIED VEHICLE: 2003-05 Murano (Z50) – 2WD and AWD Models
APPLIED VINS: 2003 MY - 2WD: JN8AZ08T*3W100007-123688
2003 MY - AWD: JN8AZ08W*3W200005-238520
2004 MY - 2WD: JN8AZ08T*4W200003-228686
2004 MY - AWD: JN8AZ08W*4W300006-343525
2005 MY - 2WD: JN8AZ08T*5W300104-302827
2005 MY - AWD: JN8AZ08W*5W400011-404496
NOTE: Use Service Comm (P5215) to confirm eligibility.
Subject: 2003-2005 Murano Alternator Voluntary Safety Recall Campaign
Attention – Dealer Principals, Sales, Parts and Service Managers
***** Campaign Announcement *****
Nissan is conducting a Voluntary Safety Recall Campaign on approximately 125,466
Model Year 2003-2005 Nissan Murano vehicles. On the affected vehicles, there is a
possibility that a rotor coil wire in the alternator may break, causing the Charge
Warning and Brake Warning lamps to illuminate, the battery to discharge and, after
a short time, the engine to go into “fail safe” mode and eventually stop if the vehicle
continues to be driven.
To prevent this from occurring, Nissan will inspect and, if necessary, replace the
alternator.
****** Dealer Inventory *****
Federal law requires that new vehicles in dealer inventory which are the subject of a
safety recall must be corrected prior to delivery under a sale or lease. Failure to do
so can result in civil penalties by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration
(NHTSA).
Note: Vehicles produced after 9/24/04 are not affected by this campaign. Our
records indicate that fewer than 900 vehicles affected by this campaign remain in
dealer inventory.
Effective July 15, please use Service Comm (P5215) to determine which 2005
Murano vehicles, if any, in your inventory may require this campaign repair prior to
being retailed.
****** Repair Instructions *****
Interim Repair Instructions containing the specific inspection and repair procedures,
parts requirements and related claims information for this campaign are available on
NNAnet.com under My Documents in the Service/Campaigns folder.
***** Parts Availability *****
An adequate supply of alternators (P/N 2310M-CN10AR) is available for this
campaign. The alternator and other campaign related parts can be ordered via the
normal parts ordering process.
***** Owner Notification *****
Nissan will begin to mail Owner Notification letters on August 1, 2005 to all affected
owners.
If you have any additional questions related to this campaign, please contact your
Dealer Parts and Service Manager (DPSM).
Nissan Parts and Service Operations
07/13/2005
|
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by jaak
I've never had the fault, but it's good to know there's a chance I never will, if it's replaced/repaired under the recall.
Jaak, you said at one time you wouldn't proactively get the new alternator if there was a recall. Now that you've seen the report, have you changed your mind? |
|
|
| Kris |
I do not know about jaak, but based on my experience with industrial equipment (including various motors) I woul ddefinitely opt for a new alternator. However, my question now is what has been redesigned? Is the new alt model redesigned? Has the problem been solved? I guess we can only wait and see.
Good to hear that Nissan is doing the right thing. |
|
|
| Stoker |
| The power of the pen is still a powerful tool. I proves once again the value of this forum. |
|
|
| jaak |
quote:
Originally posted by zofsuvs
Jaak, you said at one time you wouldn't proactively get the new alternator if there was a recall. Now that you've seen the report, have you changed your mind?
Interesting question...
Well, here's my thoughts on it.
Against> I don't like them tearing apart anything, without good cause, as I feel the factory assembly procedures are better than most (I did say most) service centers.
For > Before, they did not know, or did not admit to their dealers, what the problem was, so it was a gamble if replacement would resolve anything. If the technician can accurately determine that the existing alternator was at risk of failure, and that a replacement would not suffer from this same problem, then replacement is less of a gamble than a part with a known defect.
So it's highly likely I will have it done.
Another factor that comes into play... I lease it, I don't own it. If I owned it, I'd take pictures before it went in, and then inspect it after the work.
I know it's really A.R. to do that, but I've caught a number of issues in the past, that I have immediately returned to the dealer to have resolved. (or gone to another dealer)
So would I have them replace a known defective part? I think so.
If they were still screwing around playing stupid and not acknowledging the fault? No, unless it failed. |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
| I'll risk getting the new alternator. I feel like I'm driving around with a time-bomb otherwise. And since I've already experienced one failure at a bad location, I know I don't want to go through that again. Hate having them mess with the car again, but it's the lesser of two evils I think. At least they have a new way of replacing it without removing the radiator. I later had to have my radiator replaced with a new one (at my expense), and have always wondered if it was damaged during the alternator job. |
|
|
| Corin |
My VIN is just BARELY above the range listed in the recall. Therefore, I'm assuming that I have the "new and improved" alternator.
But because the VIN is so close, I would like to find out for sure which alternator I have. Is it possible to view the part number of the alternator without taking it in to the dealer? I took a quick look last night, but it's so cramped in that engine compartment and I couldn't really find any part number displayed. Perhaps if I look up from underneath?
Any help would be appreciated. |
|
|
| Gonzo |
I can see their point. With normal driving and the CVT's effort to maximize performance/economy with more than little gas pedal movements it causes the RPMs to fluctuate. This doesn't happen with a geared tranny until you press hard on the pedal.
Now I've got the hang of it so I can accelerate at a moderate speed with the engine reving up. |
|
|
| Gonzo |
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis Fink
Ok, I'm lost. I must have missed something.
Where does it say that Nissan is going to replace all the alternators? Where does it say that all the alternators are defective?
"To prevent this from occurring, Nissan will inspect and, if necessary, replace the alternator."
It is the inspection part that scares me... how will they determine with they need to replace it. We may still have a ticking bomb after they comply with the recall.
It would be interesting to see the actual service procedures to deal with this that the tech is to follow. |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by Gonzo
"To prevent this from occurring, Nissan will inspect and, if necessary, replace the alternator."
It is the inspection part that scares me... how will they determine with they need to replace it. We may still have a ticking bomb after they comply with the recall.
It would be interesting to see the actual service procedures to deal with this that the tech is to follow.
I think jaak pointed out in an earlier post that "inspect" may mean checking to see if it's an old model alt in there, be it original or replacement At least that's what I HOPE that means. |
|
|
| MightyMo |
Absolutely awesome!!! Wohoo!!!!
:2: :2: :2: :2: :2: :2: |
|
|
| Kris |
I do not believe that dealer techs can check alternators for impending failures. If I understand the failure mode correctly, it is wire fatigue. It cannot be detected easily. So if this is the case, all alternators that have same design are prone to this particular failure mode.
I tend to agree with posters above that they will simply check the alternator serial number or type and based on the information make decision - replace or not. Or rather replacement is necessary or not.
Dennis,
If the alternator design allows for easy wire fatigue I would not take the chances and keep the old one. Even if you “baby sit” you car. Remember, it is “wire fatigue” and the way you drive the car may just extend the time to failure.
Just my 2c. |
|
|
| MightyMo |
| Considering there is a brand new Nissan part number, something there never was before (remember our part number speculations were based on the subcontractor's part number, Nissan's number never changed), does that mean everybody who still has the old part number is going to get a brand new alternator? Which therefore includes those of us who have had warranty replacements? I sure hope so, that would help give me even more peace of mind...:4: |
|
|
| CopperKat |
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis Fink
I have not had my alternator replaced and based on the explanation of the problem and Homer's theory about hard (agressive) drivers, I know I probably will not encounter the problem. I baby my Murano and I expect to keep it for a long time. I don't think I've ever seen the rpms go over 4500.
My alternator failed at 19,000 miles and I can assure you that I do not drive my Murano hard, nor am I an "aggressive" driver, and by no means was that the cause of my alternator failure. So, you should not assume that this will not happen to you. |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by MightyMo
Considering there is a brand new Nissan part number, something there never was before (remember our part number speculations were based on the subcontractor's part number, Nissan's number never changed), does that mean everybody who still has the old part number is going to get a brand new alternator? Which therefore includes those of us who have had warranty replacements? I sure hope so, that would help give me even more peace of mind...:4:
I have to think everyone who does not have a redesigned alternator will get one under this recall, regardless of whether they have already had a replacement under warranty or not. |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by CopperKat
My alternator failed at 19,000 miles and I can assure you that I do not drive my Murano hard, nor am I an "aggressive" driver, and by no means was that the cause of my alternator failure. So, you should not assume that this will not happen to you.
I agree. I don't think I'm an aggressive driver, but mine failed nonetheless. I just hope I can get a new alternator before mine fails again.
Word has gotten out about the alternator problem and there is a recall coming. I think we're done with the lists and polls at this point. People can decide for themselves whether they want to take advantage of the recall. I'm sure Nissan would be more than happy if you didn't. Just don't have an accident and try to sue them if it does fail. |
|
|
| MOpar |
| Thanks to all involved from us who haven't failed YET!!!!! |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by MOpar
Thanks to all involved from us who haven't failed YET!!!!!
You've never failed us MOpar!
Yes, thanks to those who haven't had an alternator failure but still participated in getting the word out and contributing to this discussion. Usually it takes it happening to you to realize that having an alternator fail is not just like going in for an oil change at some point when you see the light go on. You may have an hour of driving left, and that's it. Pot luck whether you can get to a dealership before it fails, and the dealership's open, and happens to have the right alternator in stock, and can do it while you wait. I can tell you, none of that happened in my case.
So again, thanks to everyone who helped with the cause. And let's hope none of our members has another alternator failure before they can take advantage of the recall. But if the Alternator Failure List told me anything, that ain't gonna happen. :( |
|
|
| zebelkhan |
quote:
Originally posted by zofsuvs
...Usually it takes it happening to you to realize that having an alternator fail is not just like going in for an oil change at some point when you see the light go on...(
The fear of it failing is just as bad, if not worse, than it actually failing. Thanks to this problem, and for the first time in my life, at times I wished I had my old Honda with 170K miles on it to travel with than this brand new car. Hopefully this recall will take that fear away...:4: |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by zebelkhan
The fear of it failing is just as bad, if not worse, than it actually failing.
I got you beat! How about having it fail AND worrying about it failing again! |
|
|
| zebelkhan |
quote:
Originally posted by zofsuvs
I got you beat! How about having it fail AND worrying about it failing again!
Now that IS the ultimate! :) |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by zebelkhan
Now that IS the ultimate! :)
To be fair, at least 9 people had multiple alternator failures in the forum's list. A couple as many as 3 times each. I guess THAT'S the ultimate! |
|
|
| Eric L. |
| I must admit I am not that aggressive of a driver either. Until its proven, I'm not sure if there is a link between aggressive driving and alternator failure (although the recall bulletin does suggest to that effect with "rapid changes in engine speed"). |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by Eric L.
I must admit I am not that aggressive of a driver either. Until its proven, I'm not sure if there is a link between aggressive driving and alternator failure (although the recall bulletin does suggest to that effect with "rapid changes in engine speed").
Actually, I thought we were supposed to blame everything on jaak. That's the way I'd like to go if it's okay with him. I think Nissan's up for it. |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by zofsuvs
Actually, I thought we were supposed to blame everything on jaak. That's the way I'd like to go if it's okay with him. I think Nissan's up for it.
Well we can't blame everything on jaak. Just the things that matter.... :cool: |
|
|
| zofsuvs |
quote:
Originally posted by Eric L.
Well we can't blame everything on jaak. Just the things that matter.... :cool:
I only blame jaak for "anitmatter" ... and all things starting with a vowel or consonant ... and death and taxes. Other than that, he's off the hook. :D |
|
|
| zagato27 |
| Went to the Nissan dealer today to p/u my Maxima after some service. Asked if they had received the recall info on the Mo's alternator. Surprise! They actually had it. They confirmed that Nissan would send out letters beginning in August. I have had my alternator replaced under warranty @ 15k (now 35K) and asked them if the part was the same as the replacement alternator for the recall. Service rep looked up my alternator part # and compared it and not the same. Looks like it will be replaced. Have to wait and see though. Cheers |
|
|
| UmmelGroup |
My alternator failed, and was replaced several months ago. Somehow I left the dealership without any paperwork or documentation as to the replacement part number.
I will say that my dealership replaced at no cost, and at around 40,000 miles, which was a nice gesture.
Is there any technique to check the new alternator part number, easily, from the engine compartment? (it's pretty tight in there)
Else, I'll respond to the recall notice, with a dealer inspection. |
|
|
| zagato27 |
quote:
Originally posted by UmmelGroup
My alternator failed, and was replaced several months ago. Somehow I left the dealership without any paperwork or documentation as to the replacement part number.
I will say that my dealership replaced at no cost, and at around 40,000 miles, which was a nice gesture.
Contact your dealer and they will be able to access your maintenance records and will have the part # that they installed. They really don't care if they have to replace it again, Nissan will be paying for it. Cheers
Is there any technique to check the new alternator part number, easily, from the engine compartment? (it's pretty tight in there)
Else, I'll respond to the recall notice, with a dealer inspection.
|
|
|
| zagato27 |
quote:
Originally posted by UmmelGroup
My alternator failed, and was replaced several months ago. Somehow I left the dealership without any paperwork or documentation as to the replacement part number.
I will say that my dealership replaced at no cost, and at around 40,000 miles, which was a nice gesture.
Is there any technique to check the new alternator part number, easily, from the engine compartment? (it's pretty tight in there)
Else, I'll respond to the recall notice, with a dealer inspection.
Ooops, sorry about the first response. Here's my answer. Contact your dealer and they will be able to access your maintenance records and will have the part # that they installed. They really don't care if they have to replace it again, Nissan will be paying for it. Cheers |
|
|
| bob1 |
NNA Murano 2005 April 8, 2002 (SOP) – September 24, 2004 125,500
Question guys, my build date is 9/03.
From the above info it looks like I'm in. Will this be a no questions asked, here is your new alternator or will they have to look or test something?
Thanks
Bob1 |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by bob1
NNA Murano 2005 April 8, 2002 (SOP) – September 24, 2004 125,500
Question guys, my build date is 9/03.
From the above info it looks like I'm in. Will this be a no questions asked, here is your new alternator or will they have to look or test something?
Thanks
Bob1
Its based on VIN number, which itself is tied to production date. If your VIN number falls within the recall, you'll get a notice and the dealer will check your vehicle to see if you've ever received the updated part. If you have not, they'll replace your alternator with the updated one. |
|
|
| zebelkhan |
quote:
Originally posted by Eric L.
Its based on VIN number, which itself is tied to production date.
You mean model year, because early 2003 models were manufactured in 2002 and the recall document does not have or show any 2002 production dates....:D |
|
|
| larry1960 |
Mine is 9-05 Do I fall under the recall????
Thank you |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by larry1960
Mine is 9-05 Do I fall under the recall????
Thank you
Check your VIN number. Did you mean 9-04 or 9-03, else you would have a Murano that came from the future (at least you would know it could do 88mph if that was the case). |
|
|
| larry1960 |
quote:
Originally posted by Eric L.
Check your VIN number. Did you mean 9-04 or 9-03, else you would have a Murano that came from the future (at least you would know it could do 88mph if that was the case).
The sticker on the door is sept 04 do i fall under the recall????The car is a 2005?? |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by larry1960
The sticker on the door is sept 04 do i fall under the recall????The car is a 2005??
Again I will tell you to check the VIN number. Thats the only way to be sure. VIN number is located on the top of the dash, visible through the front drivers side windshield. If your VIN number is within the recall range (see previous posts above) then you'll get a letter from Nissan. If not, you already have the updated alternator, which gives you less to worry about. |
|
|
| KSmurano |
Bloomberg article
Nissan Recalls 125,466 Muranos to Fix Electrical Flaw (Update1)
2005-07-18 09:37 (New York)
(Adds 2005 recalls in third paragraph.)
By Rip Watson
July 18 (Bloomberg) -- Nissan Motor Co., Japan's second-
biggest automaker, is recalling 125,466 Murano sport-utility
vehicles in the U.S. to fix an electrical flaw that can cause an
engine shutdown.
The recall covers 2003 through 2005 models, the National
Highway Traffic Safety Administration said on its Web site today.
A wire can break in the alternator, causing the battery to lose
its charge. ``After a short time'' the engine will slow down and
may stop running, the agency said. Nissan dealers will replace the
alternator.
Nissan's recalls through June 30 had fallen 93 percent to
44,000 from the same period last year. Recalls through June 30 by
all automakers declined 61 percent from the first six months of
last year. Recalls last year reached a record 30.7 million during
the full year.
Tokyo-based Nissan, whose U.S. headquarters is in Gardena,
California, didn't return calls requesting comment. The Murano
recall will begin on Aug. 3, NHTSA said. Automakers do recall
repairs at no charge to consumers and typically pay for them out
of reserves set aside for that purpose.
--Editor: Versical
Story illustration: For other auto recalls, see {NI RECALL <GO>}.
For the NHTSA Web site, see http://www.odi-nhtsa.dot.gov. For top
transportation news, see {TRNT <GO>}.
To contact the reporter on this story:
Rip Watson in Washington at (1)(202) 624-1912 or
rwatson3@bloomberg.net
To contact the editor responsible for this story:
Dave Versical at (1)(248) 827-2944 or
dversical@bloomberg.net |
|
|
| Kris |
So it is a bad alternator design. It is kind of surprising as it is not a new element as CVT is not new. I would like to see the difference between the old and the new. What really changed? Is it worth getting replacement? I am uneasy to let mechanics “play” with my engine. Or am I wrong?
I wonder when the first letters from Nissan start arriving. Let’s make sure we post it on this board. And the results of replacement. |
|
|
| ekaxel |
| If it is a good replacement, it should be invisible...... |
|
|
| donnakaty |
Yea!!! I just heard on CNN that the Muranos finally are subject to a recall--you guys were on it first, I am SLOW!! Mine has given me no more problems since it went out at 7500 miles, and now has 25000 on it, but my husband wants to know how we find out if our new alternator is the "new improved" variety? Thanks for all your help, and especially the link to the NHSTA--guess they DO listen if enough prople send in --I got a couple of e-mails from them, so felt good about it. Still just love my Murano, though! By the way, I am WAY too old for the rest of you--I just like the small SUV look and performance--can't stand to be caught in a "little old lady" luxury car, even if I AM Old (64). I don't like to use the "O" word--just MATURE, please!! Thanks again for all the info.
Donnakaty |
|
|
| Jim C |
From what I understand, the old alternator design had some space in one of the coils allowing the wires to flex during rapid engine speed changes. This caused eventual wire fatigue and alternator failure. The redesigned alternator is supposed to have a tighter tolerance to eliminate the flex, as well as a more robust coil overall. Hopefully, this fix will do the trick.
As for those asking about their repaired alternators, check the paperwork. If you alternator part number ends in AR, you have the redesigned unit. If not, you have the old one and it needs replacing. I'm one of those that had the alternator replace (as late as last month) and I'm going to need the updated version installed. |
|
|
| zebelkhan |
quote:
Originally posted by donnakaty
I am WAY too old for the rest of you--I just like the small SUV look and performance--can't stand to be caught in a "little old lady" luxury car, even if I AM Old (64). I don't like to use the "O" word--just MATURE, please!!
First, welcome! Second, our membership ranges from 17 to 78 so you do not have the seniority here...:D
And we all love our Muranos for different reasons. I also like the way it looks and with the alternator problem solved, I like it even more now...:) |
|
|
| psrome |
My alt. just failed, for the first time, at 60,000 miles. I bought an extended warranty so it was covered. However, I had to pay my $50 deductable and $105.00 for a tow to the dealer. Does anyone know if I have any way of recouping that money?
Thanks,
jerry |
|
|
| Eric L. |
quote:
Originally posted by psrome
My alt. just failed, for the first time, at 60,000 miles. I bought an extended warranty so it was covered. However, I had to pay my $50 deductable and $105.00 for a tow to the dealer. Does anyone know if I have any way of recouping that money?
Thanks,
jerry
Yes you should be able to claim it under the recall notice. When you receive the recall letter, I would call Nissan and ask what the procedure is. |
|
|
| Dave N |
quote:
Originally posted by hfelknor
Dave
Unless your MO idles at 6000 RPM, how do you suppose it gets there?
Rapidly.
Almost instantaneous.
Quicker than any "normal" auto transmission model in the universe.
The Normal Engine connected to a normal tranny has to wait for the speed to build, the VQ connected to the CVT does not.
THAT's the rapid change in engine speed they are talking about.
A bit of an indication perhaps of each individuals driving habits?
Those of us who generally (nearly all the time) give it about 2000 RPM and then let the speed build might have less problems then
those who just NAIL it on a regular basis are moving the coil in the alternator ("jerking" it really) and that is why, although the same alternator is being used on several different cars, the problem seems to be mainly with Muranos.
The Altima for instance has the same alternator but it has a regular geared auto tranny.
It took Nissan a while to figure it out (understandably) but they are doing the right thing.
I will have to rethink some of my criticism' of the company.
Homer
Hey Homer,
Thanks for the reply. Firstly, I meant my post to be tongue-in-cheek but after reading your response, it sparked some more thoughts (bad thing for me :) ). I understand what you've said in your post above, but I take a different interpretation of the powertrain set up in the Murano. Specifically, the torque converter plays an important role here. Now, I'm not saying this torque converter is identical to one used in an automatic transmission,. However, from my observations when the Murano accelerates from a stop, I believe the transmission works much like an automatic during the first moments of acceleration. It isn't until a short time after takeoff, that the torqe-converter locks up and provides a direct link to the CVT. During the time that the torque converter isn't locked up, yes it is allowing the engine to increase it's speed in response to the position of the throttle, but it isn't unregulated - in other words, I believe the torque converter is applying some level of "dampening" the rate of acceleration of the engine speed.
I guess where I'm getting hung up is the term "instantaneous" when describing the motor (not vehicle) speed when one presses on the accelerator. It's hard to compare the rate of change in engine speed (as a function of time) compared to vehicles with other drivetrains (manual or automatic transmissions). Once again, I'm citing from personal observations over a fair range of vehicle types where I haven't noticed a drastic difference in the rate of change of engine speed. There is little question in my mind that - as you said - driving habits play a big role in this situation. I've seen cases where people start up their cars and literally throw the car in gear and accelerate away barely before the starter has disengaged (shiver). Being the son of a mechanic, I always learned not to do such a thing to my cars.
Disclaimer time : I am not implying that the alternator problem is not related to rapid changes in engine speed. All I am doing is engaging in a discussion about some of the nuances that are unique to our vehicles. No hate mail please :p: It's not that I disagree with what you've said, I think we're looking at different shades of grey with the end user being the final tie-breaker.
Thanks again.
Dave N. |
|
|
| KSmurano |
Just walked down to the mail box & guess what???? :confused:
Is this the first notice ???
A Bright Orange card in the mail from my dealer "State Line Nissan"
URGENT/RECALL NOTICE
Your Nissan automobile has an open (unrepaired) recall on it.
It is in your best interest to get it fixed in order to assure that you have a
safe vehicle. The manufacturer has attempted to contact you and now has
turned it over to us. We URGE you to either call or come in and allow us to
repari your Murano at no charge.
This is Extremely Important. Call 816-942-4007 TODAY
P5215 Alt
STATE LINE NISSAN
I'm happy to get the notice but also royaly pissed off.
NO ONE HAS MAILED OR CALLED ME AT ALL!! :3: :3: :3:
The have my name, address, home phone, cell phone & my wifes cell phone.
SO HOW IN THE HELL DID THEY NOT GET ME :confused: :confused: |
|
|
| Tyler_Canada |
| Maybe it's just luck, but I regularily nail the throttle at lights, as well as just for fun, I downshift a lot even a high speeds, so my engine speed is all over the place. I haven't had a failed alternator yet (knocks on head). |
|
|
| Eric L. |
Yippee the first official report of people getting recall notices.
quote:
Originally posted by KSmurano
Just walked down to the mail box & guess what???? :confused:
Is this the first notice ???
A Bright Orange card in the mail from my dealer "State Line Nissan"
URGENT/RECALL NOTICE
Your Nissan automobile has an open (unrepaired) recall on it.
It is in your best interest to get it fixed in order to assure that you have a
safe vehicle. The manufacturer has attempted to contact you and now has
turned it over to us. We URGE you to either call or come in and allow us to
repari your Murano at no charge.
This is Extremely Important. Call 816-942-4007 TODAY
P5215 Alt
STATE LINE NISSAN
I'm happy to get the notice but also royaly pissed off.
NO ONE HAS MAILED OR CALLED ME AT ALL!! :3: :3: :3:
The have my name, address, home phone, cell phone & my wifes cell phone.
SO HOW IN THE HELL DID THEY NOT GET ME :confused: :confused:
|
|
|
| Richie |
quote:
Originally posted by KSmurano
Just walked down to the mail box & guess what???? :confused:
Is this the first notice ???
A Bright Orange card in the mail from my dealer "State Line Nissan"
URGENT/RECALL NOTICE
Your Nissan automobile has an open (unrepaired) recall on it.
It is in your best interest to get it fixed in order to assure that you have a
safe vehicle. The manufacturer has attempted to contact you and now has
turned it over to us. We URGE you to either call or come in and allow us to
repari your Murano at no charge.
This is Extremely Important. Call 816-942-4007 TODAY
P5215 Alt
STATE LINE NISSAN
I'm happy to get the notice but also royaly pissed off.
NO ONE HAS MAILED OR CALLED ME AT ALL!! :3: :3: :3:
The have my name, address, home phone, cell phone & my wifes cell phone.
SO HOW IN THE HELL DID THEY NOT GET ME :confused: :confused:
It's my guess this isn't an official Manufacturer's Recall Notice, but actually just an invitation from your dealer to let him perform the "Recall" repair. I don't think the Manufacturer has tried to contact anyone yet.
Rich E: :confused: |
|
|
| Kris |
I agree with Richie. It does seem like a dealer trying to cash in on the opportunity.
KSMurano,
I would be p......d o.... like you. I would most likely call the dealership and tell them what I think about them. Anyway, it would be interesting to call them and ask about appointment for, let’s say tomorrow and a rental as you are “inconvenient by the situation”….I wonder what would be their reaction……. |
|
|
| KSmurano |
Well I just called & made an appointment.
They were fully tomorrow, but will do it on Thursday 7/21! :2:
It takes 3 hours so they wouldn't do a car, but the service rep was very good & calmed me down! :)
It will be nice not having this hang over my head & wondering when my luck was going to wear out. |
|
|
|
