[Kris]

While at tire shop this morning I saw this ad. Just couldn’t resist taking picture of it (sorry for the quality, though it was just phone camera)…

Tire experts – is there a merit in these claims?

 

[Ohio Murano]

I would think the pressure may not fluctuate as much during tempature changes but as far as the other claims, who knows. Also what happens if you have a flat tire and put regualr air back into it? Is that corner going to ride rougher? Interesting questions!!!

 

[GripperDon]

YUP at least 20% better than Air. :2:


Don't you love all those non specific terms, improved, increased, better, reduced, not a single specific or % in the bunch.


Personally, I use ARGON! and that we can quanity as being inert so not oxidation of the rubber at all and the molecular size difference makes the leakage 12 times less. ( I get free Argon so the cost is 0% higher.)

 

[SugarRushMurano]

SHould be ok...

I would think the pressure may not fluctuate as much during tempature changes but as far as the other claims, who knows. Also what happens if you have a flat tire and put regualr air back into it? Is that corner going to ride rougher? Interesting questions!!!

That barner claims that Nitrogen will help the tire life yada yada. That needs to be proven hehehe...

Using the periodic table as reference:
http://education.yahoo.com/reference/encyclopedia/entry?id=36717
When you pump in regular air, the Nitrogen will bind with oxygen in regular air. Remember, breathable air contains Nitrogen and Oxygen. Hence it turns back to regular air, a bit Nitrogen - rich ...

 

[GripperDon]

Forgot to mention, I do the Argon with fill, empty , fill to flush out as much Air as possible.

 

[jaak]

That dealer scares me.

 

[GripperDon]

I have never noticed any differenc in Ride Quality. I do it for:
1. Fun
2. Argon has lower thermal conductivity.
3. Larger Molecule for less leakage
4. Trully inert for longer life on the rubber (now we all have rotting rubber don't we)
5. Might make the TPMS senders last longer.

So as you can see #1 is #1
:2:

 

[Kris]

That dealer scares me.

Me too. So far they have been very good. Did the balancing twice and were very understanding. Today, the service advisor even said that they had lots of problems with Yokohamas. However, on the receipt they stated: "tires requested by customer. Not recommended for Murano. Tires balance within specifications". This is the first time they said it.

I think they realized that there is a real problem with the tires and are trying to bail out. I will be back at the dealer Monday most likely. The prospect of driving these tires for another 18 months annoys me to say the least……

Tire experts: besides tire balance what else can cause vibrations?

PS. I may suggest that if they use Nitrogen, or better Argon problem may disappear…….

 

[GripperDon]

You can say it.


PS what dealer are you all talking about, or does my computer switch threads?

 

[Eric L.]

The nitrogen idea comes from the racing scene where nitrogen may be used since it does not expand/contract as much as normal air (which is mostly nitrogen anyways) due to temperature difference. Will it make a difference in a race car driving 150mph on the track? Maybe. Will it make a difference in a Murano? Not likely.

 

[GripperDon]

I get lost with that reasoning.

The universal gas law is (Thanks to Boyle) PV=MRT

Assume same initial tire pressure and tire volume.

The delta pressure assuming the same delta temperature

P= MRT/V scratch V's as equal and T's as same delta

Then the Delta P= is proportional to MR

M= 32 Nitrogen and 28 for Oxygen

R fo Nitrogen is 286 and R for Oxygen is 359

The MR product is 8288 in both cases. Therefore the Delta Pressure is the same.

Maybe Race drivers may need more study and less Gas (intestinal type)

 

[Kris]

Don,

I am not surprised you got lost. You went the logical way. The explanation is simple:

1. marketing b...s
2. bottom line (profit)
3. c.....s ignorance

 

[jaak]

It's the old "If you'll buy it, I'll sell it to you!" problem.

Yes, I meant dealer, as in tire dealer (or tyre dealer for the brits snooping and thinking about getting a Murano. Stop snooping, go order one and get on here!)

It reminds me of an old english fair I attended in CA. (Excuse for a bunch of hippies to get together and have fun...)

There was this guy walking around yelling "Nothing for Sale! I have Nothing for sale. If you give me something, I will give you Nothing! Nothing for sale! You can get Nothing for Something!"

I think he moved into the tire business.

 

[mgthe3]

LOL

U guys are funny!
:jester:
but seriously....why haven't they come out with a very thick (say, 2") tube made out of air bubble impregnated, super low durometer, RTV silicone? It would make your tires essentially flat proof and very quiet. Or maybe just put that coating inside the tire.
Or is this just another Marty dream....
:jump3:

 

[saito]

Why not just dispense with air/nitrogen/argon altogether and put a set of Michelin Tweels on your MO?

 

[GripperDon]

Those Tweels should be neat in the snow! Given time the "Concept" may develop into what we drive on.

 

[jaak]

Yeah, they'd load up with ice and snow and vibrate like crazy! Even the Murano's wheels will do that.

 

[GripperDon]

Probably give the Yokohama mamas a shimmy for their money. Maybe by the time they are perfected the "spokes" will be heated and teflon coated.

 

[promike]

Read an article by 2 auto experts and they agree that all the claimed benefits for the everyday driver are bull. Think about it. You say that you are using nitrogen or argon to stop gases (oxygen etc)from rotting the tire...what about the outside of the tire that is exposed to the nasty gases like oxygen? Hmmmm....

 

[GripperDon]

TRUE TRUE, It's all BS as I tried to show giving the equation for pressure ands temp. I used ARGON mainly for FUN as I called the #1 reason. We use Argon in Hybrid Airbag inflator so I have availability to it. It's strictly novelty, It is Inert and does not oxidize the inner contact Areas of the tire or wheel etc.