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Discussion Starter #1
Good afternoon dear community!

A week ago I could not start my Murano 2009, turned out to be broken starter motor. Car was towed to a service for starter motor replacement, but tow truck driver forgot to turn off the ignition while towing, so the battery fully died. Next day when I came for my car, I noticed VDC Off и Slide lamps on. I asked the technician and he "remembered" that after their fixes when he was backing up from the garage, the car was going a bit tight as if something holds it. He connected it to a computer and saw DTC C1142 (PRESS SEN CIRCUIT). My questions like "maybe you shortened something or disconnectd a wire during repairs?" the guy answered like "no-no, that starter motor is situated in totally different place, we could not. We charged the battery only after changing the starter motor."

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I read Service Manual and found that that pressure sensor can be calibrated. I thought it may help, so I ordered Consult III, installed and connected to my car, but for some reason I did not find such menu item where it should be ("PRESS SEN CALIBRATION"). There were only two other items: "ADJUSTMENT OF STEERING ANGLE SENSOR" и "DECEL G SEN CALIBRATION".

The car really almost can't move while ignition is on and break is not depressed. When I put it in Drive or Reverse and release brakes, it simply does not move and I need to push on gas for it to move, but I can feel that brakes are still holding it to a degree. It worth noting that when ignition is off and car is in Neutral, it's possible to push her, but when in Neutral with ignition on - it's impossible. I think it proves that this is not the parking brake, but an ABS issue.

I have checked pressure sensor readings via Consult III (according to Service Manual), it's 0 with no brake and 80-100 with brake pedal depressed fully, so it matches normal range of 0-170. Just in case "DECEL G-SEN" reading is 0.01.

I have few questions:
  1. Do you think that ABS unit or that specific sensor could have been damaged while replacing starter motor with dead battery?
  2. Why do you think "PRESS SEN CALIBRATION" item is absent in Consult III? I'm looking at Repair -> EL. Repair -> ABS -> Work Support, according to the Service Manual it should be there, but it's not... Am I missing something?
  3. I heard that such code sometimes pops up when some cables/harnesses get disconnected by mistake. If to assume I have a similar situation, where should I look to check it, assuming I have Z51 trim (i.e. 2009 model)? I know and saw the ABS unit itself, but not sure where are the electric cables/harnesses I could check for accidental disconnects...
  4. A bit offtopic, but during diagnostics in Consult III I noticed a choice of "CAN type 4" or "CAN type 5". Could you please help me understand what does it mean and what should I chose during diagnostics? Google search did not help...
FYI: there is another DTC I have in the list: B2109: S/L RELAY OFF. Not sure if it may be related...

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Thank you very much for your help!
 

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I have few questions:

1. Do you think that ABS unit or that specific sensor could have been damaged while replacing starter motor with dead battery?
The battery really needs to be removed anyway to replace the starter so I don't think that's likely.

2. Why do you think "PRESS SEN CALIBRATION" item is absent in Consult III? I'm looking at Repair -> EL. Repair -> ABS -> Work Support, according to the Service Manual it should be there, but it's not... Am I missing something?
Do you have the actual factory scan tool used by Nissan dealerships? Where did you buy it (post a link if you can)?

I haven't looked in quite some time, but I recall those being a few thousand dollars and Nissan doesn't sell them to the general public. I do notice that there seem to be quite a few knock-offs that use the "Consult III" name.

3. I heard that such code sometimes pops up when some cables/harnesses get disconnected by mistake. If to assume I have a similar situation, where should I look to check it, assuming I have Z51 trim (i.e. 2009 model)? I know and saw the ABS unit itself, but not sure where are the electric cables/harnesses I could check for accidental disconnects...
If all the shop touched was the starter then you can raise the front end of the car, remove the driver-side wheel and splash shield and look around. It is worth noting that the IPDM is in that vicinity and the engine room and transmission harnesses are right there.

4. A bit offtopic, but during diagnostics in Consult III I noticed a choice of "CAN type 4" or "CAN type 5". Could you please help me understand what does it mean and what should I chose during diagnostics? Google search did not help...
You'll find this information in the "LAN System" section of the service manual.

FYI: there is another DTC I have in the list: B2109: S/L RELAY OFF. Not sure if it may be related...
That looks like a historical code that's no longer active.

BTW...have you tried clearing the code? Or, disconnecting the battery negative cable for an hour or so and reconnecting?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Do you have the actual factory scan tool used by Nissan dealerships? Where did you buy it (post a link if you can)?
Yes, sure, I got it from here. The device itself says it's "made in France". I also heard that they're expensive, but assumed this one is not because it does not include the computer (I used mine own), plus it's for older vehicles.

If all the shop touched was the starter then you can raise the front end of the car, remove the driver-side wheel and splash shield and look around. It is worth noting that the IPDM is in that vicinity and the engine room and transmission harnesses are right there.
Thank you, will check it out! Since you mentioned IPDM, I remembered that we also checked every fuse in the box under the hood on the driver side - they all were OK (we thought it may be related).

BTW...have you tried clearing the code? Or, disconnecting the battery negative cable for an hour or so and reconnecting?
Yes, the shop tried to clear the codes, VDC Off and Slide disappeared after that. Although C1142 remained it seemed. Then technician took the car for a ride, came back and VDC Off and Slide came on again. He cleared it again, took for another ride and the lamps did NOT come back, so he gave the car back to me. Although, when I drove it home, I noticed that it slows down more than usual when I release gas pedal, even when going downhill - it was not the case before. When I came home, I noticed rims were hot, but no smoke or something. Then I checked if car stays still when in Drive or Reverse and confirmed it, so I realized the problem did not go away... After I connected Consult III, VDC Off and Slide came up again and I did not clear it, so it's still ON.

I guess, I can try disconnecting the battery for an hour as you suggested. But I thought, maybe that sensor should be calibrated every time the battery dies like that? I don't think so, but worth asking...

Thank you for the reply!
 

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I'm interested in Consult III too if it's reasonably priced. It would be awesome to have the real Nissan Consult III application for working on my Murano, if that's what you purchased.

Looking forward to seeing the link to it...
 

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Yes, sure, I got it from here. The device itself says it's "made in France". I also heard that they're expensive, but assumed this one is not because it does not include the computer (I used mine own), plus it's for older vehicles.


Thank you, will check it out! Since you mentioned IPDM, I remembered that we also checked every fuse in the box under the hood on the driver side - they all were OK (we thought it may be related).


Yes, the shop tried to clear the codes, VDC Off and Slide disappeared after that. Although C1142 remained it seemed. Then technician took the car for a ride, came back and VDC Off and Slide came on again. He cleared it again, took for another ride and the lamps did NOT come back, so he gave the car back to me. Although, when I drove it home, I noticed that it slows down more than usual when I release gas pedal, even when going downhill - it was not the case before. When I came home, I noticed rims were hot, but no smoke or something. Then I checked if car stays still when in Drive or Reverse and confirmed it, so I realized the problem did not go away... After I connected Consult III, VDC Off and Slide came up again and I did not clear it, so it's still ON.

I guess, I can try disconnecting the battery for an hour as you suggested. But I thought, maybe that sensor should be calibrated every time the battery dies like that? I don't think so, but worth asking...

Thank you for the reply!
I checked out that company's website and they're based in China so I suspect that it's not the actual factory tool. Nevertheless, it has quite a bit of functionality (esp. for the price). It could be that the pressure sensor test is in another menu--I don't know as I don't own that tool? If you can't find it elsewhere then I suppose you could ask the company about it directly and perhaps there's an update they can provide you that adds that function.

Is the ABS light on in addition to the VDC light? When those lights are illuminated, the respective systems go into fail-safe mode and the car should behave as if those systems aren't installed at all (i.e. no ABS and/or VDC). That is, you should have normal brakes sans those safety features. If the brakes are sticking then perhaps it's a mechanical problem.

Going back to your first question about whether or not the shop could have damaged the ABS Control Unit--I would think they diagnosed a bad starter before just replacing it and, if so, that would require hooking up a jump charger to the battery. Still, I'm not sure you can pin this one on the shop, but it sure is a coincidence if you had no such problems before this... BTW, was the brake system serviced recently?
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I checked out that company's website and they're based in China so I suspect that it's not the actual factory tool.
Yes, it came from China. But the VI (device) itself says "Made in France" on it. Plus, the Service Manual itself references the tool as Consult III. It looks like this software is from Nissan itself. Maybe The tool (VI) is not official, but it surely works fine with the official software that is called Consult III...

It could be that the pressure sensor test is in another menu--I don't know as I don't own that tool? If you can't find it elsewhere then I suppose you could ask the company about it directly and perhaps there's an update they can provide you that adds that function.
The tool is simply a VI (Vehicle Interface) which works with the official Nissan program called Consult III. Since this menu is not in the tool but in the software itself, I thought maybe someone here used it for such calibration and could tell me if I'm looking in the correct place (Repair -> EL. Repair -> ABS -> Work Suppor)...

Is the ABS light on in addition to the VDC light?
It's only on when VI is connected. Also BRAKE is on when VI is connected. When I disconnect, only VDC Off + Slide remain on.

When those lights are illuminated, the respective systems go into fail-safe mode and the car should behave as if those systems aren't installed at all (i.e. no ABS and/or VDC). That is, you should have normal brakes sans those safety features. If the brakes are sticking then perhaps it's a mechanical problem.
That is interesting, I did not know that. But the thing is that this code talks about sensor circuit failure, so I thought if it's sensor problem, it does not know when to apply which pressure or maybe it's off and requires calibration. The fact that breaks are off when ignition is off means that it's not just stuck... Anyway, hoping it's not that serious...

but it sure is a coincidence if you had no such problems before this
Exactly! Did not have such problems! That's what very strange...

BTW, was the brake system serviced recently?
No, not recently. It was serviced in April 2019 due to official ABS-related recall 18V916. Brake fluid DOT3 was replaced with DOT4. The car only did about 1000 miles after that and there were no issues before replacing that starter motor...
 

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Have you tried disconnecting the ABS Control Unit and driving the car to see if those symptoms go away? BTW...what information was in the "FFD" link next to the trouble code description in your diagnostic software?
 

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Have you tried disconnecting the ABS Control Unit and driving the car to see if those symptoms go away?
No, I did not know I can do that... Can I? If so, is it easy to disconnect it?

what information was in the "FFD" link next to the trouble code description in your diagnostic software?
I did not understand it frankly. I will double-check it later today and add a screenshot.
 

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No, I did not know I can do that... Can I? If so, is it easy to disconnect it?

I did not understand it frankly. I will double-check it later today and add a screenshot.
It's a lever-style harness connector that's commonly used for control units (see below), but on second thought just remove the fuse (it should be marked on the IPDM). The ABS connector would be a pain to get to anyway given the location on the firewall.

Either way, make sure to disconnect the battery before connecting/reconnecting the ABS module and I wouldn't suggest driving the car very long since you're only trying to determine if the symptoms go away when the ABS module has no power to it (e.g. just do the drive and reverse tests you cited before and maybe take a very short drive around the neighborhood). ECM will probably also throw a bunch of codes for the wheel speed sensors since the ABS module coordinates those signals.
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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
what information was in the "FFD" link next to the trouble code description in your diagnostic software?
IMG_3844.JPG

I wouldn't suggest driving the car very long since you're only trying to determine if the symptoms go away when the ABS module has no power to it (e.g. just do the drive and reverse tests you cited before and maybe take a very short drive around the neighborhood).
So I did it few days ago, using the fuse. Obviously few lamps went on (including ABS), but I noticed that that braking issue went away. It was much easier to back up, as well as go forward. So looks like it is really ABS...

By the way, why you don't recommend driving like that longer than for a test? For example, I am thinking about driving like that to the service for ABS replacement to not burn my breaks... Do you think it's okay?

Or, disconnecting the battery negative cable for an hour or so and reconnecting?
I disconnected battery for the night, but it did not help :(

Now here are some readings, they look normal. Even the pressure reading (PRESS SENSOR) shows normal values with pedal depressed and released... So if it's the same sensor that causes that DTC, I have no idea why it shows proper readings...
IMG_3845.JPG IMG_3846.JPG IMG_3847.JPG IMG_3850.JPG

Also, here is that screenshot of the menu where according to the service manual (BRC) PRESS SENSOR calibration should be available, but it not (probably due to that circuit failure, or something being disconnected):
IMG_3851.JPG

If all the shop touched was the starter then you can raise the front end of the car, remove the driver-side wheel and splash shield and look around. It is worth noting that the IPDM is in that vicinity and the engine room and transmission harnesses are right there.
Before paying money for ABS replacement I would like to be sure it's not just a connection issue somewhere on the way. So today or tomorrow will check that place. The ABS harness connector that is right there near the ABS itself (it's clearly visible under the hood from the passenger side) seems to be properly connected. I also read that this sensor is actually inside of this ABS unit, so the chances that something is disconnected outside the unit and only sensor is failing are really small... :(
 

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View attachment 51874


So I did it few days ago, using the fuse. Obviously few lamps went on (including ABS), but I noticed that that braking issue went away. It was much easier to back up, as well as go forward. So looks like it is really ABS...

By the way, why you don't recommend driving like that longer than for a test? For example, I am thinking about driving like that to the service for ABS replacement to not burn my breaks... Do you think it's okay?


I disconnected battery for the night, but it did not help :(

Now here are some readings, they look normal. Even the pressure reading (PRESS SENSOR) shows normal values with pedal depressed and released... So if it's the same sensor that causes that DTC, I have no idea why it shows proper readings...
View attachment 51875 View attachment 51876 View attachment 51877 View attachment 51878

Also, here is that screenshot of the menu where according to the service manual (BRC) PRESS SENSOR calibration should be available, but it not (probably due to that circuit failure, or something being disconnected):
View attachment 51879


Before paying money for ABS replacement I would like to be sure it's not just a connection issue somewhere on the way. So today or tomorrow will check that place. The ABS harness connector that is right there near the ABS itself (it's clearly visible under the hood from the passenger side) seems to be properly connected. I also read that this sensor is actually inside of this ABS unit, so the chances that something is disconnected outside the unit and only sensor is failing are really small... :(
Was there a menu to do an ABS self-diagnosis as per the service manual? When the ABS module has no power the brakes will still work (assuming there are no mechanical defects), but I only suggested driving a short distance for safety reasons since that test was for diagnostic purposes. If you plan on driving the car then just be cognizant of the risks of driving without ABS etc.

Unfortunately, that sensor is internal to the ABS module so it looks like it needs to be replaced. I doubt it's a connection issue or there probably would have been other sensor issues and codes thrown.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Was there a menu to do an ABS self-diagnosis as per the service manual?
Yes, there was. I used it very first time and it showed that code:
Looks like I will be ordering a used ABS on e-bay to replace mine... Any suggestions about buying ABS on e-bay? I saw ones with lines (cut, but not unscrewed), also ones without lines but with red stubs... I guess with stubs should be better coz I don't need to deal with rusty nuts? Any other suggestions? Thank you.
 

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Yes, there was. I used it very first time and it showed that code:


Looks like I will be ordering a used ABS on e-bay to replace mine... Any suggestions about buying ABS on e-bay? I saw ones with lines (cut, but not unscrewed), also ones without lines but with red stubs... I guess with stubs should be better coz I don't need to deal with rusty nuts? Any other suggestions? Thank you.
I don't buy too much stuff on eBay, but in my experience the seller's reputation is the most important criteria.

BTW...did you ever contact the company you bought the Consult III software from to ask about the missing ABS pressure sensor calibration function that's cited in the service manual?
 

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BTW...did you ever contact the company you bought the Consult III software from to ask about the missing ABS pressure sensor calibration function that's cited in the service manual?
No, I did not. I suspect it's absent because of that DTC. If ECU detects that there is a "circuit failure" for a sensor, it seems logical not to be able to calibrate it...
 

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No, I did not. I suspect it's absent because of that DTC. If ECU detects that there is a "circuit failure" for a sensor, it seems logical not to be able to calibrate it...
The DTC shouldn't matter. The function is (should be?) in your scan tool software. If the DTC would prevent calibrating the sensor then you would just get an error when trying to run the function. Interestingly, if you look at the service manuals for 2010 and beyond there is no ABS pressure sensor calibration procedure. Perhaps the ABS units after 2009 are self-calibrating? This might be why you don't see that function, but only the company that sold you the software could clarify that.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Perhaps the ABS units after 2009 are self-calibrating?
Interesting! My service manual is of year 2008, so maybe you're right!

Some new things happened over these few days... First, after disconnecting that battery for the night, as I mentioned, nothing changed. After removing the ABS fuse and driving back and forth - nothing helped as well. But a day later I decided to check the DTCs again and found that there are a lot more this time:
Screenshot (10).png Screenshot (11).png Screenshot (12).png Screenshot (13).png

I decided to clear all of them, just for sake of trying since I have nothing to lose. After that I turned off the car to see if any of those come up again after I start it. I started the car back up and surprisingly did not find any DTCs, even the one for ABS! I then tried to move forward and then back up - NO ISSUE! Breaks were not holding the wheels anymore!

So, happy I went home thinking that miraculously problem resolved, but logic prevented joy from taking over :) So next day I decided to have a trip to the post office. It all began smooth as if car has no issues. But after about a mile of driving through the city, VDC Off + Slip lamps appeared and the issue appeared again - when gas pedal was released, the car was stopping as if break is applied (without break actually applied). I stopped the car, turned off the ignition. Then started it back again - lamps went away. I tried to go forward and backward - no issue. So I went to the post office and back home and did not see this issue. Although, I did this trying to depress the break pedal as less as I can, because I suspected it may affect the situation in some way. By the way, I must admit that since the issue started, break pedal became much more sensitive - I can just touch it and break is applied, while before I could press a lot more until the breaking started.

So, I came home, parked the car and read DTCs. Only one appeared:
Screenshot (26).png Screenshot (27).png

I also realized (and checked with diagnostic tools) that I can depress my pedal to 13 bar and the stop light is not on. If I press it more - it lights up. I don't think it was the case before.

So, I deleted this code hoping for another miracle, but no - after that and restarting the car, the car stays still when in D or R and break is released :( Also, again, when parked and ignition turned on, few seconds after that the car moves few millimeters as if break is released - it's actually visible.

If you have anything to say about that - I would appreciate any thoughts/suggestions. I'm thinking about buying an ABS on e-bay and simply replacing it in a service shop :(
 

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I also realized (and checked with diagnostic tools) that I can depress my pedal to 13 bar and the stop light is not on. If I press it more - it lights up. I don't think it was the case before.
As soon as the brake pedal is moved, the brake light should be coming on. If you're applying any more pressure, as the above quote states, then you need to replace the brake switch before going any further.

This could be the root of your problem. Brake light switches are now designed to engage as soon as the pedal is moved, due to the disengagement function of cruise control. CC needs to be disengaged before brakes can be applied, hence the sensitive brake light switch.

As soon as the pedal is moved, usually about 1 cm, CC is disengaged, brake lights are lite. Depending on the car, brakes will start to engage at about 3 - 5 cm of brake travel.

If the brakes are engaging (grabbing) before the brake lights are coming on, then again, you need to replace the brake light switch located under the dash above the brake pedal.

Good luck.

Have a good day.
 
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I agree with PaulDay. Before spending a big chunk of cash for a new ABS Control Unit, troubleshoot the brake lamp switch and circuit. In fact, that is one of the first steps of the diagnostic procedure for that DTC (C1116).
 

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I just want to expound on the newer brake light switches for a minute.

They are weak and fragile! Instead of just one contact, it's several contacts, interlinked thru the CPU to function properly.

Human habit when shifting from Park is to press the brake pedal harder then what is necessary to stop the car when coming to a stop while driving, when stopping under normal conditions! I have observed this phenomenon hundreds of times while test driving with customers. I'm positive that most of the readers here do the same thing, without even being aware of it. The brake pedal needs to be pressed only to the same extent as to keep the car from rolling after stopped, when shifting from Park. Notice that this is actually less pressure needed then when coming to a stop. Check for yourselves and let me know if this happens to you. I'll bet it does!

This I believe causes most of the premature brake light switch failures.

People make the mistake of jamming on the brake pedal when checking the brake light system. Wrong! When checking the brake lights, brake pedal should be pressed down less then 2 cm, lights coming on before the brakes start to engage.

Hope this help out.

Have a good day.
 
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Discussion Starter #20
Thank you guys for your replies!

Depending on the car, brakes will start to engage at about 3 - 5 cm of brake travel.
That was the case before the issue, before that starter died. Also, AAA technician who came to tow my car to the service to replace the starter, first thing ensured that brake light is functioning properly. He told me that he had clients whose car did not start because of that (brake pedal was not recognized as depressed). But he checked it and it was okay. Maybe he "overpressed" it back then, who knows? All I know is that after the starter was replaced - the break became very sensitive - just touching it would feel as if I am firmly pressing it. And obviously this subject ABS Pres Sensor problem appeared...

Before spending a big chunk of cash for a new ABS Control Unit, troubleshoot the brake lamp switch and circuit
Okay, will try! My only two concerns are:
1. Why C1116 did not came up in the very beginning? It looks like it was not an issue before yesterday...
2. How brake lamp switch can affect ABS work and pressure sensor-related errors? How because of the break lamp switch the car may be braking without depressing the pedal? Just curious...

So far my guts feeling is that it may be two problems at the same time... But I will check that switch first.

I've checked the service manual steps for checking stop lamp switch circuit. Sorry for the lame question, but where is that connector E36 and Terminal 16 shown in the table below? Is it one of the pins in the ABS harness connector itself? I.e. the one that is near the ABS? It means I need to remove lots of stuff to get to it, right?
51901
 
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