Thanks Homer. about 5 minutes after I posted my problem, I went poking around on the Sticky threads. I did not see my brake problem but I dove into the TSB's. You can imagine my delight as I found a TSB for the brake squeek. I rush back to post my finding and there you are with the answer that I just found.
No wonder your a Super duper senior member.
Thanks Bob1

 

Didn't work for me. After a couple of weeks, the squeal came back.

 

I have the same problem. The dealer turned my rear rotors because of "glazing". The very first stop after leaveing the dealer ship I heard the eeeeeeek.... Mine happens when moving forward. I think it's actually coming from the front brakes. The dealer said they have several options for this problem. I just get tired of going back and forth. They need to just replace the pads and be done with it. .

 

CopperKat, did you click on Homer's link? They are doing a pad replacement kit. Did they follow the TSB or did they even know about the TSB? Did they JUST resurface and send you out the door?

HTRK, I don't think your deal is the same deal as the TSB, you have something going on but don't think this is the same. Our's only happens in reverse when cold.

Bob1

 

Bob1

They did know about the TSB. I printed it out and took it to the dealer. I wanted to show them that they needed to order special pads and grease. I then made my appointment for two weeks later, and they supposedly had ordered the special parts and installed them. Who knows. They may have just used a stock brake pad and never ordered the ones listed in the TSB.

 

CopperKat, I just set up Monday Dec-6 as an appointment to get the TSB done. I see on the TSB they must verify the noise. I called the dealer and advised I'll bring her in on Sunday night and leave it as this would be the only way to get cold pads for them to hear the noise.
I also made them check for the parts on the TSB. They had them in stock but would not have ordered them in advance. Word of warning, you may take your car in, they may hear the noise, they may call you and say we need parts, pick up your car. What a wasted trip that would be. They won't order parts on a say-so, they want proof. I'm lucky they had the parts from the TSB.
I'll keep you posted on my results.
Bob1

 

While cleaning my wheels I noticed that the rotor surfaces were not as shiny as they should be. Upon closer inspection, I saw a thin layer or film of rust on them. I also noticed that after driving the car, the film goes away but comes back after the car has been parked overnight.

I have never seen this in another car I have owned. I mean all rotor surfaces rust but not this quickly. I wonder if this is contributing to the first "cold" squeel?

 

to all, my 2003 mo with 13,000 miles has had the back up squeek for some time, despite the TSB being performed.

but now, it has a forward sqeek sometimes when driving after being parked all day, and it doesn't seem to matter if in the garage or outdoors. its a squeek, squeek, squeek. not a continuous one like the back up one. comes from the left side. the vehicle has no driveline vibration, and i doubt i would bring it in for repair at this time, unless it gets a lot worse. everytime they work on it, there is a great risk of something else being messed up.

anyone else with this type of squeek? it sounded like one person had it. thanks. rr70

 

Yeah, that was the point of my original visit. I wanted them to hear the noise and then order the parts if need be. The service manager told me "I believe you when you tell me that the brakes squeak. You don't need to prove it to me. We'll take care of it".

 

...The service manager told me "I believe you when you tell me that the brakes squeak. You don't need to prove it to me. We'll take care of it".

Wow I didn't think a Nissan dealership like that existed!

 

OTOH. I had the normal experience.
Trip 1 cannot reproduce And since most of our customers are liars we don't believe you.
Trip 2 OK. We heard it. You need new brake pads. No, we don't have them. We will order them and call you.
Of course they didn't call.
When I called a couple of weeks later, they had the parts.
Trip 3 install brake pads. that worked.

Sorry, but I got far better service at American car dealers.

And when I talk about Squeak!
It was so loud that you could hear it a block away.
Very embarassing and all my fellow old coots rubbed it in.
Hard.
Told me I shouldn't have bought a cheap japanese car bulit outa beer cans.
I was very close to agreeing with them.

Now, I love the car and hate the company .

Homer

 

This problem continue surviving ... it happens on my 2005 Murano SE. Not every morning, but once or twice a week, I think it will become 7 days a week pretty soon!!

Will schedule my first non-scheduled visit to my dealer.

Why Nissan don't want to change these pads design!

Anyway glad to find this website!

 

I had to delay my scheduled visit to the dealer as the brakes had failed to squeek for a week. I knew the service tech would not do the required fix without hearing the problem. This week they are back to form, nice and loud. May be the cold weather, don't know for sure but they seem to act up more in the cold. It will go down to the coldest temps of the season on Wednesday morning with expected low temps of 17 degrees F. I'll be sure to post after my service visit.
In the mean time, stay warm folks.
Bob1

 

I wonder if it is a pad or rotor problem. Certainly Nissan must know how to make brakes, just do it like everybody else does. Do you suppose it's a bad batch of rotors from a supplier cutting corners on material?

 

I wonder if it is a pad or rotor problem. Certainly Nissan must know how to make brakes, just do it like everybody else does. Do you suppose it's a bad batch of rotors from a supplier cutting corners on material?

Its pad compound . . . . there isn't much difference in metallurgy between rotors.

Jap cars tend to use very hard pads = high metallic content = noisy. I planned on switching to Axxis Deluxe Plus anyways once I get mine.

Dave

 

Are you sure? Take a Look at what zebelkhan said up above.

"While cleaning my wheels I noticed that the rotor surfaces were not as shiny as they should be. Upon closer inspection, I saw a thin layer or film of rust on them. I also noticed that after driving the car, the film goes away but comes back after the car has been parked overnight.

I have never seen this in another car I have owned. I mean all rotor surfaces rust but not this quickly. I wonder if this is contributing to the first "cold" squeel?"

 

TSB DONE!

UPDATE, just back from dealer,(20-Dec-04) performed TSB mentioned above in this thread. Left dealer lot and all is quiet. The real test is when the car is sitting outside with cold temps. Yes, it appears somehow the really cold temps seem to have an affect on these brakes. How I have come to this conclusion was just letting the car sit outside for several hours vs inside the semi-warm garage. The garage must be about 58 degrees F while temps outside lately have been as low as 15 or 19 degrees. When outside, the brakes would squeel like a stuck pig and inside the garage, nada.
I did leave the car at the dealer Sunday night so the squeel would surley be present on Monday AM. I made sure to put it in a spot where they would have to back it up. I left them a copy of the TSB.
I will update this post if it does not fix the problem. A side benefit to having this work done is getting new pads up front for free.
Stay tuned.
Bob1

 

Are you sure? Take a Look at what zebelkhan said up above.

"While cleaning my wheels I noticed that the rotor surfaces were not as shiny as they should be. Upon closer inspection, I saw a thin layer or film of rust on them. I also noticed that after driving the car, the film goes away but comes back after the car has been parked overnight.

I have never seen this in another car I have owned. I mean all rotor surfaces rust but not this quickly. I wonder if this is contributing to the first "cold" squeel?"

You're in AZ . . . there needs to be humidity in order for it to rust.

Dave

 

I'm in Arizona and He is on the coast in California!

 

If it helps anyone... mine use to sqeak and at some point without intervention... they stopped. ~6 months and 8,000MI latter. Go figure.

 

Without reading 4 pages, has anybody tried this:

It won't eliminate the squeal, but it will make it non-audible for humans.

Brake squeal is normal and it's a factor of pad compound and temperature. The factory Ferodos for my 350z has a slight squeal in cold weather, but my ultra-agressive track pads will squeal on the street even in the Summer (however, pad temps get high enough at the track that the squeal goes away).

Michael.

 

This is only a hypothesis. The rotors contain some Iron in them ( carbon, nickle, carbon who knows or care but some iron) Iron will oxidize. The pads rub off this iron oxide (rust). This rust collects on the pads. The rust tends to cohere to the Iron and then has to "let go" this repeaters and repeats. The grabbing and releasing occurs at high frequency and this is "heard" as a squeal. A additive soaks into the pad and stops or changes the nature of the material building up on the pad so it either no longer grabs and releases or doest it a lot faster raising the frequency of action and the sound we hear of this action occurring.

 

It seems this goes in cycles.

Now we are at the "It's Normal" cycle.
And this is from an owner, not a service department!

Look, brakes squealing is NOT normal. And by the way, let's not get into a "If a tree falls in the woods and there is no one there to hear it....................is there a "sound""
A squeal, by definition, can be heard. If there is a vibration above human hearing, that's what it is, a vibration. A squeal is a human definition for a high pitched sound that can be heard.

So. A very loud squeal while backing up is not normal.

That is why Nissan has a TSB to FIX the problem.
Service Bulletin Num : 04011
Date of Bulletin: JAN 21, 2004 View Document

Component: BRAKES
Summary: REDUCTION OF FRONT BRAKE NOISE WHEN BRAKING IN REVERSE, COLD

Nissan doesn't fix what is normal. The Fix BTW is a DIFFERENT set of Brake pads. Not a new set, but a different set.

At least in my case, it worked. It was done at about 5000 miles and I am now at 12000 miles without the problem returning.
I would imagine it works in all cases. All they are doing is breaking up the "sympathetic" conditions that cause the squeal.

If you are talking about a "slight squeak", you don't have the problem.
The problem is that the "marriage" between the parts sets up a sympathetic vibration, that we who have/had the problem can hear AT least a half mile away. That is NOT an exaggeration.


Brake squealing USED to be normal. But I haven't had it on any of my cars for YEARS.

99 Miata
97 Chrysler T&C
94 SC Tbird
93 Jaguar XV8
89 Mustang 5.0
89 SHO


Those cars were all purchased new. None squealed LOUDLY(Obviously a few minor squeals when a pebble got caught in the pad, is not what I am talking about)
Had any of them Squealed LOUDLY, I would have returned them. NONE of them had a TSB to address loud brakes. None of them.

So two points.
1- We have to define the "problem".
Again, if you can't hear it a half mile away, you don't have "the problem".
2- TSB 04011
and Nisssan does not develop and TSBs to address what is normal.


Homer


Michael, gooping the brakes was done by the factory. And if you do it, it might even work. Anything to break up this sympathetic mating of parts could help. As a matter of fact, that's what my dealer did before the TSB was developed. In my case it helped for a couple of weeks, then this LOUD squeal returned.
I nearly sold the car because of it.


Gripper, it appears that the WHOLE rotor rusts. Not just the part that comes in contact with the pads. I suspect that this is, in the end, the real problem with the Brake Squeal. Since none of the other Nissans have rotors that rust overnight, I suspect the compound of the rotor was changed. As to the fix, It's cheaper to change the pads.
BTW I see that you have now made more posts in a few weeks than I have made in over a year! Congratulations, I guess.:1:


3:42 AM?! I can't sleep!

 

Without reading 4 pages, has anybody tried this:

It won't eliminate the squeal, but it will make it non-audible for humans.

Brake squeal is normal and it's a factor of pad compound and temperature. The factory Ferodos for my 350z has a slight squeal in cold weather, but my ultra-agressive track pads will squeal on the street even in the Summer (however, pad temps get high enough at the track that the squeal goes away).

Michael.

Thats for caliper pins not pads.

 

It seems this goes in cycles.

Now we are at the "It's Normal" cycle.
And this is from an owner, not a service department!

Look, brakes squealing is NOT normal. And by the way, let's not get into a "If a tree falls in the woods and there is no one there to hear it....................is there a "sound""
A squeal, by definition, can be heard. If there is a vibration above human hearing, that's what it is, a vibration. A squeal is a human definition for a high pitched sound that can be heard.

So. A very loud squeal while backing up is not normal.

That is why Nissan has a TSB to FIX the problem.
Service Bulletin Num : 04011
Date of Bulletin: JAN 21, 2004 View Document

Component: BRAKES
Summary: REDUCTION OF FRONT BRAKE NOISE WHEN BRAKING IN REVERSE, COLD

Nissan doesn't fix what is normal. The Fix BTW is a DIFFERENT set of Brake pads. Not a new set, but a different set.

At least in my case, it worked. It was done at about 5000 miles and I am now at 12000 miles without the problem returning.
I would imagine it works in all cases. All they are doing is breaking up the "sympathetic" conditions that cause the squeal.

If you are talking about a "slight squeak", you don't have the problem.
The problem is that the "marriage" between the parts sets up a sympathetic vibration, that we who have/had the problem can hear AT least a half mile away. That is NOT an exaggeration.


Brake squealing USED to be normal. But I haven't had it on any of my cars for YEARS.

99 Miata
97 Chrysler T&C
94 SC Tbird
93 Jaguar XV8
89 Mustang 5.0
89 SHO


Those cars were all purchased new. None squealed LOUDLY(Obviously a few minor squeals when a pebble got caught in the pad, is not what I am talking about)
Had any of them Squealed LOUDLY, I would have returned them. NONE of them had a TSB to address loud brakes. None of them.

So two points.
1- We have to define the "problem".
Again, if you can't hear it a half mile away, you don't have "the problem".
2- TSB 04011
and Nisssan does not develop and TSBs to address what is normal.


Homer


Michael, gooping the brakes was done by the factory. And if you do it, it might even work. Anything to break up this sympathetic mating of parts could help. As a matter of fact, that's what my dealer did before the TSB was developed. In my case it helped for a couple of weeks, then this LOUD squeal returned.
I nearly sold the car because of it.


Gripper, it appears that the WHOLE rotor rusts. Not just the part that comes in contact with the pads. I suspect that this is, in the end, the real problem with the Brake Squeal. Since none of the other Nissans have rotors that rust overnight, I suspect the compound of the rotor was changed. As to the fix, It's cheaper to change the pads.
BTW I see that you have now made more posts in a few weeks than I have made in over a year! Congratulations, I guess.:1:


3:42 AM?! I can't sleep!

Have any of you guys heard of bedding your pads? Semi-metallic pads tend to squeal a lot more than organic pads and therefore need to be occasionally bedded in order to keep the mating surfaces level with one another.

Rotors rust, its a fact of life. Some hats don't rust because they're cadmium plated, however rust doesn't affect performance on the hat.

I wouldn't be surprised to find grooving of the rotors in those who do experience brake squeal. Perhaps they should be taught a lesson in braking.

Rust gets wiped off the rotor usually in the first full brake depression. For the most part, it collects on the side of the brake pad. Washing your brakes every once in awhile also helps. My guess is that the squeals are a result of not bedding the pads / uneven wear / pad compound (semi metallic). Just to make a point, the two muranos that I drove were not driven for awhile and both had rust on the rotors (I live in the freakin desert too), not a peep from both rotors when I pulled out of the parking spot.

For those of who you have no idea WTH bedding is . . . .

http://www.zeckhausen.com/bedding_in_brakes.htm

Dave